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From: Ted Dunning <ted.dunning@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 30 Oct 2010 13:10:16 -0700
Message-ID: <AANLkTinEQviy8Eo8S-2MeVJ7EGewyBrtwFJn772UHASt@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Lucene.NET Community Status
To: general@lucene.apache.org
Cc: lucene-net-user@lucene.apache.org,
	lucene-net-dev <lucene-net-dev@lucene.apache.org>
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It is great to see that there really is support.  It sounds to me like
Incubator to top-level is a great plan.

I am one of the Java crowd and thus would have a hard time convincing
anybody that I should have a vote on the
future of any .net project, but it really does seem that there is the core
of a great community here.

On Sat, Oct 30, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Glyn Darkin <glyn@darkinsystems.com>wrote:

> Hi Guys,
>
> Loosing Lucene.Net would be a major loss to the .Net community.
>
> Count me in, I will help in any way I can. I have never supported an
> open source project before, so have a lot to learn, but just point me
> in the write direction and I will help.
>
> Cheers
>
> Glyn
>
>
> On 30 October 2010 18:56, Simone Chiaretta <simone.chiaretta@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > I think that being not subscribed to the other mailing list probably my
> > email will end up only in the user ML.
> > Personally I think inside the ASF there is no awareness of how widespread
> is
> > Lucene.net in the .NET world:
> > It is used by many big projects, both opensource and commercial: for
> example
> > Raven DB, a commercial/opensource NoSQL database is using it as
> foundation.
> > Also Umbraco is using Lucene if I'm not wrong, and also Orchard and many
> > other are using it, including NHibernate.
> > And many big consulting companies are using it for their projects
> >
> > Personally I put Lucene.net into Subtext and developed a few PoC at the
> > company I'm working for at the moment, but nothing major.
> >
> > I wrote a series of posts on Lucene.net on my blog and many people were
> > wondering if the Lucene.net project was dead: this because there has not
> > been a real release since years.
> >
> > Personally I'd love to see Lucene.net a main project, not under the
> umbrella
> > of the Java version. And I'd also love to see it not just being a
> > line-by-line port of the Java version, but that it also adopts the same
> > conventions of .NET applications: in .NET there is are GetSize and
> SetSize
> > methods as in java, but there would be the Size property. And so on.
> >
> > Talking about the official release: I'm pretty sure that if you take the
> > 2.9.2 version and just make a binary release it will be good, since it is
> > used by some many people without problems. But I don't know which are the
> > requirements of the ASF for releasing official releases.
> >
> > Personally I don't care if Lucene.net is part of the ASF, in the
> incubator
> > or hosted on CodePlex as standalone project, as long as there are
> releases,
> > and some committers are working on it.
> > Maybe Lucene.net could follow the same steps of NHibernate: it was just
> the
> > step-child of Hibernate, owned by the same "company" and later it evolved
> to
> > a project with its own dignity and ownership, implementing features that
> > didn't exist in the java version (like Linq and now ConfORM), and not
> just
> > doing line-by-line posting.
> >
> > Personally I'm willing to help writing some documentation, but I don't
> have
> > the time to contribute on code as I'm already working on other opensource
> > project.
> >
> > Probably this is not the most coherent email I wrote, but I hope it has
> some
> > interesting points of discussion.
> >
> > HTH
> > Simone
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Oct 30, 2010 at 2:52 PM, George Aroush <george@aroush.net>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Grant,
> >>
> >> I'm perfectly fine going back to incubation, that will help us to
> >> re-validate this project and hopefully bring in some new blood.  If we
> do
> >> so, beside the current committers, who have had experience with
> Lucene.Net
> >> and the Apache way, who else do we bring in as new initial committers?
> >>  What
> >> criteria do we use?  Should we start with the current committers and in
> 3-6
> >> months add / remove from the list?
> >>
> >> Btw, sorry to post this to 3 different mailing list, but I hope by doing
> so
> >> it gets some extra visibility.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> -- George
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Grant Ingersoll [mailto:gsingers@apache.org]
> >> Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2010 6:59 AM
> >> To: lucene-net-user@lucene.apache.org
> >> Cc: general@lucene.apache.org; lucene-net-dev@lucene.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: Lucene.NET Community Status
> >>
> >>
> >> On Oct 29, 2010, at 11:19 PM, George Aroush wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hi Grant and all,
> >> >
> >> > I will get engaged with the project again.  The way I see it, by the
> end
> >> of
> >> > the year, we must:
> >> >
> >> > 1) Clean up the website, and / or
> >> > 2) Create an official release off the current trunk, and
> >> > 3) Sometimes next year, port the most current version of Java Lucene.
> >> >
> >> > If by the end of the year, if we don't manage #1 and / or #2,
> Lucene.Net
> >> > should be at the mercy of Apache's PMC.
> >>
> >> Please see the original email below.  You also need new blood
> contributing
> >> to the project.  One active committer for a project that has been around
> >> this long is not enough.  You also need a plan for self determination,
> i.e.
> >> to either become a top level project (i.e. lucenenet.apache.org or
> >> something
> >> like that) here at the ASF or for spinning out somewhere else under a
> new
> >> name.  This will be better for the project as you will then be guided by
> a
> >> PMC that is made up of the community members who have a stake in the
> >> project, as opposed to now where you have a PMC, other than George, that
> is
> >> largely unaware of Lucene.NET and has no stake in Lucene.NET and is not
> >> informed enough to make decisions about new committers, releases, etc.
> and
> >> likely isn't even capable of running Lucene.NET (I'm on a Mac, for
> >> instance.)
> >>
> >> In fact, if I were active in this community, I would put the self
> >> determination piece of the puzzle before all others because it has a
> number
> >> of effects that make 1, 2 and 3 easier for you.  Personally, I would go
> >> back
> >> to the Incubator with a proposal for re-entry there that adds at least
> 4-5
> >> new committers based on volunteers stepping up here.  Once you have 4-5
> new
> >> committers, then you have people who can do the work to get a release
> out,
> >> clean up the website and, most importantly, learn how developing code at
> >> the
> >> ASF works.  You also then have the genesis of a PMC that makes for a
> >> sustainable project and one where you can get 3 binding PMC votes for a
> >> release (which you may not be able to do at the moment under Lucene
> simply
> >> because other than George, there are not any .NET programmers on the PMC
> >> who
> >> can verify the release is viable.)
> >>
> >> I can help you craft the proposal to go into the Incubator, as I feel it
> is
> >> part of my duties as Chair to see some resolve on this project, but
> beyond
> >> that I personally am not interested in being involved.  I do think there
> >> needs to be a .NET version of Lucene, though, so I wish you all the best
> of
> >> luck in keeping the project alive.
> >>
> >> -Grant
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > The key for our success is for the community working together -- we
> can't
> >> > have few folks doing the heavy lifting of the project.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> >
> >> > -- George
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: Grant Ingersoll [mailto:gsingers@apache.org]
> >> > Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 4:48 PM
> >> > To: lucene-net-user@lucene.apache.org
> >> > Cc: Lucene mailing list; lucene-net-dev@lucene.apache.org
> >> > Subject: Lucene.NET Community Status
> >> >
> >> > FYI: This message was sent to the lucene-net-dev@lucene.a.o list on
> Oct.
> >> 25
> >> > and elicited zero replies.  I am sending it here in the hopes that
> some
> >> of
> >> > you will step forward and either bring this project back to life via
> >> going
> >> > back to the Incubator or we put it in the Apache Attic and someone can
> >> take
> >> > and maintain it somewhere else under a different name per the terms of
> >> the
> >> > Apache License.
> >> >
> >> > ---
> >> > Hi .Netters,
> >> >
> >> > The Lucene PMC would like to ask everyone involved with .NET if they
> >> might
> >> > chime in on the status of this project.  There hasn't been a commit
> since
> >> > July 2010 (and that one was trivial and there were only 2 in June) and
> >> there
> >> > seems to be very little activity on the dev mailing list.  There also
> has
> >> > not been a release in a long time.  This was brought up at the last
> >> Lucene
> >> > Board Report and it doesn't appear that there has been any action
> since.
> >> A
> >> > community should be able to withstand the loss of a single committer,
> but
> >> > here it appears that there are no longer any committers willing to
> work
> >> on
> >> > the project.
> >> >
> >> > In order to remedy the situation, we would like the following things
> to
> >> be
> >> > done:
> >> > 1.  The community needs to show some (sustained) life.  Not just in
> code,
> >> > but in discussion of the project's future, etc.  We would expect the
> >> > committers to take a leadership role here.
> >> > 2. The community needs to do a real release that is voted on by the
> PMC.
> >> > 3. The webpage needs to be updated to reflect that those previous
> >> "source"
> >> > releases are not real releases and should be taken down.  Likewise,
> the
> >> news
> >> > section should not tout these non-releases as releases.  The website
> >> should
> >> > also meet the PMC Branding guidelines recently sent out.
> >> > 4. Identify some new blood for contributors/committers.  Or the
> current
> >> > committers need to step up more and take a lead role in the community.
> >> >
> >> > We would like to see action on all of these things by the end of this
> >> year.
> >> > If they can't be met, there will be one of the following actions:
> >> > 1. Go back into Incubation
> >> > 2. Go into the Apache Attic.  If someone wants to take the code base
> and
> >> > fork it out as a project somewhere else under a new name that does not
> >> use
> >> > the Lucene trademark name (since that is owned by the ASF) than that
> is
> >> > perfectly acceptable under the Apache license.
> >> >
> >> > If the conditions can be met, we think that the project should spin
> >> itself
> >> > out as its own Top Level ASF project with its own PMC so that its
> future
> >> > direction can be set by the stakeholders of the project and not by the
> >> > larger Lucene project as a whole.
> >> >
> >> > Sincerely,
> >> > Grant Ingersoll
> >> > On behalf of the Lucene PMC=
> >> >
> >>
> >> --------------------------
> >> Grant Ingersoll
> >> http://www.lucidimagination.com
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Simone Chiaretta
> > Microsoft MVP ASP.NET - ASPInsider
> > Blog: http://codeclimber.net.nz
> > RSS: http://feeds2.feedburner.com/codeclimber
> > twitter: @simonech
> >
> > Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic
> > "Life is short, play hard"
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Glyn Darkin
>
> Darkin Systems Ltd
> Mob: 07961815649
> Fax: 08717145065
> Web: www.darkinsystems.com
>
> Company No: 6173001
> VAT No: 906350835
>

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