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From "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <chris.a.mattm...@jpl.nasa.gov>
Subject Re: Factor out a standalone, shared analysis package for Nutch/Solr/Lucene?
Date Mon, 01 Mar 2010 17:01:15 GMT
Hi Grant,

> On Mar 1, 2010, at 8:20 AM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J) wrote:
> 
>> Hi Robert,
>> 
>> I think my proposal (Solr->TLP) is sort of orthogonal to the whole analyzers
>> issue - I was in favor, at the very least, of having a separate
>> module/project/whatever that both Solr/Lucene (and whatever project) can
>> depend on for the shared analyzer code...
> 
> Not really.  They are intimately linked.

Ummm, how so? Making project A called "Apache Super Analyzers" and then
making Lucene(-java) and Solr depend on Apache Super Analyzers is separate
of whether or not Lucene(-java) and Solr are TLPs or not...

Cheers,
Chris


> 
> 
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Chris
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 3/1/10 9:12 AM, "Robert Muir" <rcmuir@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> this will make the analyzers duplication problem even worse
>> 
>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2010 at 11:06 AM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J) <
>> chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi Mark,
>>> 
>>> Thanks for your message. I respect your viewpoint, but I respectfully
>>> disagree. It just seems (to me at least based on the discussion) like a TLP
>>> for Solr is the way to go.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Chris
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 3/1/10 8:54 AM, "Mark Miller" <markrmiller@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> On 03/01/2010 10:40 AM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J) wrote:
>>>> Hi Mark,
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> That would really be no real world change from how things work today.
>>> The fact
>>>>> is, today, Solr already operates essentially as an independent project.
>>>>> 
>>>> Well if that's the case, then it would lead me to think that it's more of
>>> a
>>>> TLP more than anything else per best practices.
>>>> 
>>> That depends. It could be argued it should be a top level project or
>>> that it should be closer to the Lucene project. Some people are arguing
>>> for both approaches right now. There are two directions we could move in.
>>>> 
>>>>> The only real difference is that it shares the same PMC with Lucene now
>>> and
>>>>> wouldn't with this change. This would address none of the issues that
>>>>> triggered
>>>>> the idea for a possible merge.
>>>>> 
>>>> I don't agree -- you're looking to bring together two communities that
>>> are
>>>> "fairly separate" as you put it. The separation likely didn't spring up
>>> over
>>>> night and has been this way for a while (as least to my knowledge). This
>>> is
>>>> exactly the type of situation that typically leads to TLP creation from
>>> what
>>>> I've seen.
>>>> 
>>> It also causes negatives between Solr/Lucene that some are looking to
>>> address. Hence the birth of this proposal. Going TLP with Solr will only
>>> aggravate those negatives, not help them.
>>> 
>>> While the communities operate fairly separately at the moment, the
>>> people in the communities are not so separate. The committer list has
>>> huge overlap. Many committers on one project but not the other do a lot
>>> of work on both projects.
>>> 
>>> There is already a strong link with the personal - merging the
>>> management of the projects addresses many of the concerns that have
>>> prompted this discussion. TLP'ing Solr only makes those concerns
>>> multiply. They would diverge further, and incompatible overlap between
>>> them would increase.
>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Chris
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 03/01/2010 10:04 AM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J) wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hey Grant,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I'd like to explore this<   does this imply that the Lucene
>>> sub-projects will
>>>>>> go away and Lucene will turn into Lucene-java and maintain its Apache
>>> TLP,
>>>>>> and then you'd have say, solr.apache.org, tika.apache.org,
>>> mahout.apache.org
>>>>>> (already started), etc. etc.? If so, that may be the best of all
>>> worlds,
>>>>>> allowing project independence, but also not following the Apache
>>>>>> "antipattern" as Doug put it...
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 3/1/10 7:28 AM, "Grant Ingersoll"<gsingers@apache.org> 
 wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Also, as Doug alluded to, the Board is likely to ask us to consider
>>> less
>>>>>>> subprojects in the future, so we may be consolidating and spinning
off
>>>>>>> anyway.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>>>>>> Senior Computer Scientist
>>>>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>>>>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>>>>>> Email: Chris.Mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov
>>>>>> Phone: +1 (818) 354-8810
>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>>>>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>>>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> - Mark
>>>>> 
>>>>> http://www.lucidimagination.com
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>>>> Senior Computer Scientist
>>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>>>> Email: Chris.Mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov
>>>> WWW:   http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/<http://sunset.usc.edu/%7Emattmann/>
>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> - Mark
>>> 
>>> http://www.lucidimagination.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>>> Senior Computer Scientist
>>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>>> Email: Chris.Mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov
>>> WWW:   http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/<http://sunset.usc.edu/%7Emattmann/>
>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Robert Muir
>> rcmuir@gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>> Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
>> Senior Computer Scientist
>> NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
>> Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
>> Email: Chris.Mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov
>> WWW:   http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>> Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
>> University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>> 
> 
> 


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: Chris.Mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov
WWW:   http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++



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