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From "Andreas Bothner [ MTN - Innovation Centre ]" <bothn...@mtn.co.za>
Subject RE: Plans for supporting a build in level of "trace"
Date Mon, 22 Sep 2003 15:59:47 GMT
Hi,

I agree that this debate will carry on forever, because we all work
differently.  I believe having one trace level is good compromise.  The
way I work is to put debug statements into the code to decipher what is
happening in the program flow, but I would love to have a trace level to
print out parameter values or variable values.  The debug level gets
extremely verbose when logging out array values etc and all you are
interested in is program flow.

Andreas

-----Original Message-----
From: Lutz Michael [mailto:michael.h.lutz@siemens.com] 
Sent: Monday, 22 September 2003 17:49
To: 'Log4J Users List'
Subject: RE: Plans for supporting a build in level of "trace"



This topic is a source of endless debate where I work.

We have groups that actually separate "event logging" from "tracing",
and support about 5 levels of each.  So, instead of just 1 trace level,
they use
5 different levels of tracing.

I doubt the end of this debate will ever be reached with consensus.

My opinion - I like to keep things simple, and thus 1 level of debug is
fine for me, but I have heard people argue successfully for additional
levels.
For instance, 1 level of debugging that operations may be able to
understand, a lower level that developers understand without source code
in front of them, and an even lower level of tracing that requires
source code in front of a developer.

The debate rages on ... the addition of a single trace level might be a
reasonable compromise.  This will also incur change in a lot of
documentation - these levels are documented in a lot of places.




-----Original Message-----
From: Shapira, Yoav [mailto:Yoav.Shapira@mpi.com]
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2003 11:42 AM
To: Log4J Users List
Subject: RE: Plans for supporting a build in level of "trace"



Howdy,

>"TRACE" or "FINE" is one that many seem to agree is sensible and
required.

That's the part I'm not convinced of.  How do you support the above?

>I think the idea is, no matter how many or few default levels there
are,
>the defaults should cover the range of the "logging space" completely.
>FATAL pretty much covers it on one end of the spectrum.
>On the other end we need a  logging level whose messages would be so 
>verbose and so often called that we would almost never need a finer
level.
>DEBUG is too general purpose for that.

I disagree, think DEBUG is fine for the other end of the spectrum, and
wouldn't use something lower than that.  However, if there's really an
overwhelming majority of people who disagree, then by definition I'm in
the minority and these levels should be added ;)  But I'm yet to be
convinced this is the case...

Yoav Shapira



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