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From Krzysztof Sobkowiak <krzys.sobkow...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Third-Party Licensing Policy
Date Fri, 10 Jan 2014 08:09:39 GMT
I meant the [camel,servicemix]-extra projects from googlecode. It would 
be nice to have git repositories for the code.

Regards
Krzysztof

On 10.01.2014 09:05, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote:
> I didn't create the karaf-extra project yet as we didn't have the need.
>
> I will create it when we need some extra/contrib.
>
> When you said "any plans to migrate the projects", you mean Karaf 
> projects ?
>
> Regards
> JB
>
> On 01/10/2014 08:21 AM, Krzysztof Sobkowiak wrote:
>> Ok thanks a lot, it clarified me my questions. The license content use
>> juridical language. I don't understand it always. I could find
>> camel-extra and servicemix-extra projects. But I can't find karaf-extra.
>> Where is this project? Have you any plans to migrate the projects in git
>> (or even host on Github)?
>>
>> Best regards
>> Krzysztof
>>
>> On 10.01.2014 08:06, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote:
>>> Hi Krzysztof,
>>>
>>> I invite you to read the GPL, APL, etc license content.
>>>
>>> My comments inline:
>>>
>>> On 01/10/2014 07:36 AM, Krzysztof Sobkowiak wrote:
>>>> Hi
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for answers. I need still some clarifications. I'll use some
>>>> samples
>>>>
>>>> On 10.01.2014 05:44, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote:
>>>>> Hi
>>>>>
>>>>> It's a difference between inclusion, usage, and reference.
>>>>>
>>>>> For instance, GPL license is a intrusive license. It means that any
>>>>> software that use a code under GPL has to be itself under the GPL
>>>>> license. That's why you can't use GPL in a Apache project. It's the
>>>>> case for usage, inclusion or reference.
>>>>> LGPL is a bit permissive in the cave of reference. LGPL is a Category
>>>>> X for inclusion and usage. It means that it's not possible to use 
>>>>> LGPL
>>>>> if the project embeds some jar under LGPL, or ship some code (like
>>>>> copy/paste) under LGPL. However, if you just reference the project
>>>>> without embedding it, and it's an user action to actually download 
>>>>> and
>>>>> add the LGPL jar, it's fine.
>>>> I don't know if I have understood it correctly. I can reference
>>>> Hibernate libraries in Karaf feature (e.g. because it is referenced by
>>>> other library which is also included in Karaf feature ans uses the 
>>>> code
>>>> from Hibernate or because we need Hibernate as JPA provider) . But 
>>>> I can
>>>> not implement any sample with Karaf which shows, how to use Spring 
>>>> with
>>>> plain Hibernate, because the Hibernate  code (e.g. SessionFactory) 
>>>> would
>>>> be referenced in this code. But I can implement such a sample outside
>>>> Karaf (probably under another license, which? LGPL?) and eventually
>>>> reference the sample somewhere in the Karaf feature like the Hibernate
>>>> libraries?
>>>
>>> Correct. That's why we have karaf-extra (like camel-extra,
>>> servicemix-extra) to store such code/sample outside Apache codebase.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Regarding your question:
>>>>> 1/ category A
>>>>> 2/ category A
>>>>> 3/ category A and B
>>>>> 4/ category A and B (and we have to "publish" the changes)
>>>>
>>>> Does it mean I can copy some code (e.g. classes) from category B 
>>>> library
>>>> into Apache licensed project, eventually change the code, and and ship
>>>> it as part of this project (usage 3 and 4) but I can not reference the
>>>> category B libraries as maven dependencies and use the classes from 
>>>> the
>>>> dependencies in Apache licensed project (usage 1 and 2)?
>>>
>>> Not really, it depends in the license. Basically, all code in Apache
>>> project should be under Apache license. Again, we can add it in
>>> karaf-extra.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I use an example again  - AspectJ is licensed under EPL 1.0 license.
>>>> Assume I'd like to implement a WeavingHook using the AspectJ classes
>>>> (reference AspectJ as maven dependency and use the classes in my 
>>>> code).
>>>> Does it mean, my code can not be included in Apache licensed project,
>>>> but I can implement the hook in a project under other license and
>>>> eventually reference it in Karaf feature?
>>>
>>> Correct, you can't include in Apache project. You can create your
>>> project outside of Apache project and reference it. Same as before:
>>> you can do your WeavingHook in karaf-extra.
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> JB
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Best regards
>>>> Krzysztof
>>>>
>>>>> 5/ all
>>>>> 6/ category A and B
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>> JB
>>>>>
>>>>> On 01/09/2014 11:35 PM, Krzysztof Sobkowiak wrote:
>>>>>> Hi
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have some licensing questions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have found following page http://www.apache.org/legal/3party.html
>>>>>> which defines 3 categories of third party licenses. According to

>>>>>> this
>>>>>> page LGPL v2.1 is category X, but further remark says, the
>>>>>> LGPL-v2.1-licensed work can be listed as system requirements but
>>>>>> can not
>>>>>> be included  by Apache products. I'm not good in licensing but I
>>>>>> try to
>>>>>> understand it.  Is the category of LGPL really B (and the page
>>>>>> should be
>>>>>> corrected) or is the LGP category X.  In the second case, can we

>>>>>> still
>>>>>> list Hibernate in Karaf features (e.g. using the remark about
>>>>>> listing of
>>>>>> system requirements)?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Assume following use cases of third-party work usage:
>>>>>> 1. reference 3rd-party library as (maven) dependency and use the
>>>>>> classes
>>>>>> in ASF code
>>>>>> 2. reference 3rd-party library as (maven) dependency and use the
>>>>>> classes
>>>>>> only in ASF configuration files (e.g. blueprint.xml)
>>>>>> 3. include/copy some unmodified 3rd-party code (e.g. some 
>>>>>> classes) in
>>>>>> ASF project
>>>>>> 4. include/copy some 3rd-party code (e.g. some classes) in ASF 
>>>>>> project
>>>>>> and modify it
>>>>>> 5. list some 3rd-party libraries in Karaf features, but not include
>>>>>> them
>>>>>> as binaries in one of the Karaf distributions
>>>>>> 6. list some 3rd-party libraries in Karaf features, and include
>>>>>> them as
>>>>>> binaries in one of the Karaf distributions in system repository
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Could anybody please answer which of above points are allowed for
>>>>>> following 3rd-party works
>>>>>> a. category A as the whole category - I assume, all above use cases
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> allowed in this category, is it ok?
>>>>>> b. category B as the whole category
>>>>>> c. category X as the whole category
>>>>>> d. LGPL
>>>>>> e. GPL
>>>>>> f. EPL
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have chosen Karaf as sample ASF project, but it could be any
>>>>>> other ASF
>>>>>> project, e.g. ServiceMix or Aries
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do the rules from the page mentioned above apply only for ASF 
>>>>>> projects
>>>>>> or for any project licensed under Apache License?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards
>>>>>> Krzysztof
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> Krzysztof Sobkowiak
>>>>
>>>> JEE & OSS Architect | Technical Architect @ Capgemini
>>>> Capgemini <http://www.pl.capgemini.com/> | Software Solutions Center
>>>> <http://www.pl.capgemini-sdm.com/> | Wroclaw
>>>> e-mail: krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com <mailto:krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com>
|
>>>> Twitter: @KSobkowiak
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Krzysztof Sobkowiak
>>
>> JEE & OSS Architect | Technical Architect @ Capgemini
>> Capgemini <http://www.pl.capgemini.com/> | Software Solutions Center
>> <http://www.pl.capgemini-sdm.com/> | Wroclaw
>> e-mail: krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com <mailto:krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com> |
>> Twitter: @KSobkowiak
>


-- 
Krzysztof Sobkowiak

JEE & OSS Architect | Technical Architect @ Capgemini
Capgemini <http://www.pl.capgemini.com/> | Software Solutions Center 
<http://www.pl.capgemini-sdm.com/> | Wroclaw
e-mail: krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com <mailto:krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com> | 
Twitter: @KSobkowiak

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