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From Krzysztof Sobkowiak <krzys.sobkow...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Third-Party Licensing Policy
Date Fri, 10 Jan 2014 07:21:50 GMT
Ok thanks a lot, it clarified me my questions. The license content use 
juridical language. I don't understand it always. I could find 
camel-extra and servicemix-extra projects. But I can't find karaf-extra. 
Where is this project? Have you any plans to migrate the projects in git 
(or even host on Github)?

Best regards
Krzysztof

On 10.01.2014 08:06, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote:
> Hi Krzysztof,
>
> I invite you to read the GPL, APL, etc license content.
>
> My comments inline:
>
> On 01/10/2014 07:36 AM, Krzysztof Sobkowiak wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> Thanks for answers. I need still some clarifications. I'll use some 
>> samples
>>
>> On 10.01.2014 05:44, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote:
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> It's a difference between inclusion, usage, and reference.
>>>
>>> For instance, GPL license is a intrusive license. It means that any
>>> software that use a code under GPL has to be itself under the GPL
>>> license. That's why you can't use GPL in a Apache project. It's the
>>> case for usage, inclusion or reference.
>>> LGPL is a bit permissive in the cave of reference. LGPL is a Category
>>> X for inclusion and usage. It means that it's not possible to use LGPL
>>> if the project embeds some jar under LGPL, or ship some code (like
>>> copy/paste) under LGPL. However, if you just reference the project
>>> without embedding it, and it's an user action to actually download and
>>> add the LGPL jar, it's fine.
>> I don't know if I have understood it correctly. I can reference
>> Hibernate libraries in Karaf feature (e.g. because it is referenced by
>> other library which is also included in Karaf feature ans uses the code
>> from Hibernate or because we need Hibernate as JPA provider) . But I can
>> not implement any sample with Karaf which shows, how to use Spring with
>> plain Hibernate, because the Hibernate  code (e.g. SessionFactory) would
>> be referenced in this code. But I can implement such a sample outside
>> Karaf (probably under another license, which? LGPL?) and eventually
>> reference the sample somewhere in the Karaf feature like the Hibernate
>> libraries?
>
> Correct. That's why we have karaf-extra (like camel-extra, 
> servicemix-extra) to store such code/sample outside Apache codebase.
>
>>
>>> Regarding your question:
>>> 1/ category A
>>> 2/ category A
>>> 3/ category A and B
>>> 4/ category A and B (and we have to "publish" the changes)
>>
>> Does it mean I can copy some code (e.g. classes) from category B library
>> into Apache licensed project, eventually change the code, and and ship
>> it as part of this project (usage 3 and 4) but I can not reference the
>> category B libraries as maven dependencies and use the classes from the
>> dependencies in Apache licensed project (usage 1 and 2)?
>
> Not really, it depends in the license. Basically, all code in Apache 
> project should be under Apache license. Again, we can add it in 
> karaf-extra.
>
>>
>> I use an example again  - AspectJ is licensed under EPL 1.0 license.
>> Assume I'd like to implement a WeavingHook using the AspectJ classes
>> (reference AspectJ as maven dependency and use the classes in my code).
>> Does it mean, my code can not be included in Apache licensed project,
>> but I can implement the hook in a project under other license and
>> eventually reference it in Karaf feature?
>
> Correct, you can't include in Apache project. You can create your 
> project outside of Apache project and reference it. Same as before: 
> you can do your WeavingHook in karaf-extra.
>
> Regards
> JB
>
>>
>> Best regards
>> Krzysztof
>>
>>> 5/ all
>>> 6/ category A and B
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> JB
>>>
>>> On 01/09/2014 11:35 PM, Krzysztof Sobkowiak wrote:
>>>> Hi
>>>>
>>>> I have some licensing questions.
>>>>
>>>> I have found following page http://www.apache.org/legal/3party.html
>>>> which defines 3 categories of third party licenses. According to this
>>>> page LGPL v2.1 is category X, but further remark says, the
>>>> LGPL-v2.1-licensed work can be listed as system requirements but 
>>>> can not
>>>> be included  by Apache products. I'm not good in licensing but I 
>>>> try to
>>>> understand it.  Is the category of LGPL really B (and the page 
>>>> should be
>>>> corrected) or is the LGP category X.  In the second case, can we still
>>>> list Hibernate in Karaf features (e.g. using the remark about 
>>>> listing of
>>>> system requirements)?
>>>>
>>>> Assume following use cases of third-party work usage:
>>>> 1. reference 3rd-party library as (maven) dependency and use the 
>>>> classes
>>>> in ASF code
>>>> 2. reference 3rd-party library as (maven) dependency and use the 
>>>> classes
>>>> only in ASF configuration files (e.g. blueprint.xml)
>>>> 3. include/copy some unmodified 3rd-party code (e.g. some classes) in
>>>> ASF project
>>>> 4. include/copy some 3rd-party code (e.g. some classes) in ASF project
>>>> and modify it
>>>> 5. list some 3rd-party libraries in Karaf features, but not include 
>>>> them
>>>> as binaries in one of the Karaf distributions
>>>> 6. list some 3rd-party libraries in Karaf features, and include 
>>>> them as
>>>> binaries in one of the Karaf distributions in system repository
>>>>
>>>> Could anybody please answer which of above points are allowed for
>>>> following 3rd-party works
>>>> a. category A as the whole category - I assume, all above use cases 
>>>> are
>>>> allowed in this category, is it ok?
>>>> b. category B as the whole category
>>>> c. category X as the whole category
>>>> d. LGPL
>>>> e. GPL
>>>> f. EPL
>>>>
>>>> I have chosen Karaf as sample ASF project, but it could be any 
>>>> other ASF
>>>> project, e.g. ServiceMix or Aries
>>>>
>>>> Do the rules from the page mentioned above apply only for ASF projects
>>>> or for any project licensed under Apache License?
>>>>
>>>> Best regards
>>>> Krzysztof
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Krzysztof Sobkowiak
>>
>> JEE & OSS Architect | Technical Architect @ Capgemini
>> Capgemini <http://www.pl.capgemini.com/> | Software Solutions Center
>> <http://www.pl.capgemini-sdm.com/> | Wroclaw
>> e-mail: krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com <mailto:krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com> |
>> Twitter: @KSobkowiak
>


-- 
Krzysztof Sobkowiak

JEE & OSS Architect | Technical Architect @ Capgemini
Capgemini <http://www.pl.capgemini.com/> | Software Solutions Center 
<http://www.pl.capgemini-sdm.com/> | Wroclaw
e-mail: krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com <mailto:krzys.sobkowiak@gmail.com> | 
Twitter: @KSobkowiak

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