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From: Ian <ianjewe@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: A moderator's view of this list [was: Re: I Hate Your Product]
Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 21:57:13 +0100
To: "ooo-users@incubator.apache.org" <ooo-users@incubator.apache.org>

I downloaded Open Office at about 3 pm today and can't believe the deluge of=
 bad-tempered emails, largely unintelligible to me, which have landed on me s=
ince then. Is there any reason why I should go on subscribing to this or doe=
s that question answer itself?

Cheers

Sent from  my iPhone=20

On 31 Mar 2012, at 21:40, Hagar Delest <hagar.delest@laposte.net> wrote:

> Le Sat, 31 Mar 2012 09:57:48 -0400, Rob Weir <robweir@apache.org> a =C3=A9=
crit :
>> A) First, since the original poster is not subscribed to the list, he is
>> not receiving any of the responses, unless he was explicitly copied on th=
e
>> response.
>=20
> Well, it's part of the channel. There are ways to spot unsubscribed poster=
s (there are some bugs in TB preventing that, I agree) So up to the list pow=
er users to handle such posters.
> On the former OOo mailing list, users were quite used to CC OP when not su=
bscribed IIRC (and at this time TB was doing a good job at spotting the head=
ers, ok I'll stop here no TB devs here).
>=20
>=20
>> B) If the user does subscribe, they will likely soon be frustrated by
>> unrelated questions and answers, but be unable to unsubscribe themselves
>> without assistance.
>>=20
>> So we all want users to be able to resolve their issues, without
>> unnecessary complications.  I think the support forums are a much better
>> place for users to raise such questions.
>>=20
>> What do you think?   What is the purpose of this ooo-users list compared t=
o
>> the support forums?  On some project communications we advertise both as
>> equal support avenues for users to raise problems.  Is that what we shoul=
d
>> be doing?  In other words, what is the purpose of this list and how do we=

>> make that clear to users?
>=20
> Basically, I'm not sure that redirecting a user to another place (forum fo=
r example) would help, it doesn't answer the question and it adds frustratio=
n (he has to register the forum whereas he was expecting a direct answer fro=
m the list).
>=20
> What would be the list then? A place for somehow advanced users only? ... J=
ust saw your post in the mean time, so yes, that's what you want.
> Then, the solution is quite simple: forbid any non subscribed user.
> But is it really the kind of support the community wants? Some users don't=
 want to use forums, does it means that they are on their own?
> You're dealing with a low level user base with OOo. The public is not made=
 of developers used to mailing lists here, they are standard or low knowledg=
e users. The former list was full of duplicates, the same questions come aga=
in and again, but that's the job.
> We have this kind of eternal September in the forum too. We could just rep=
ly "RTFM" or "Google is your friend". But we know that if the user asked the=
 question, that's because he hasn't RTFM or searched the web or the forum. S=
o we give the reply and that's all, that's part of the job (it doesn't preve=
nt to add a note inviting to search the next time).
>=20
> Perhaps there are good reasons from our side to be bored with such users b=
ut their situation is special: they got frustrated about the application (fr=
om their point of view) and first they are not in their normal state and sec=
ond any reply that doesn't help will be seen as proof that the product is no=
t user oriented.
>=20
> Hagar
>=20
>=20
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>=20

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