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From Patrick Durusau <patr...@durusau.net>
Subject Re: Old OO.o Mailing Lists
Date Wed, 02 Nov 2011 15:14:02 GMT
Rob,

Thanks! Still looking over the archives of discussion.

Patrick

On 11/02/2011 09:14 AM, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Patrick Durusau<patrick@durusau.net>  wrote:
>> Rob,
>>
>> On 11/02/2011 07:48 AM, Rob Weir wrote:
>>> On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 3:09 AM, Michael Adams<linux_mike@clear.net.nz>
>>>   wrote:
>>>> Who now owns the website domain name?
>>>>
>>>> What i am really asking is, how easy would it be to set up a temporary
>>>> forwarder for emails to a moderator from users@openoffice.org and
>>>> discuss@openoffice.org. If you own the A record and the mail server
>>>> it is easy.
>>>>
>>>> My main concern stems from the fact that together they still generate
>>>> as much if not more mail/queries than this list.
>>>>
>>> Have yous seen the user list traffic lately?  Seems to be mainly
>>> out-of-the-office notifications and users confused about how to
>>> unsubscribe.  That leads to a death spiral for a list, as more of this
>>> noise drives more people to unsubsbcribe.
>>>
>>> In any case, we need to help users resusbcribe to the new list if they
>>> want to continue participation.  The old list is not coming down
>>> immediately, like this week or anything.  So we have time for an
>>> orderly migration.
>>>
>> What would you suggest as an orderly migration path? From what I am reading
>> on this list, the old lists are simply going to die, following messages
>> (already sent?) that users need to re-subscribe to the @apache lists. (I
>> forebear commenting on that strategy, it is the official one and unlikely to
>> change.)
>>
> Orderly migration would be:
>
> 1) Member of the Apache OpenOffice project set up new mailing lists on
> the Apache infrastructure and assign moderators.  We've done that.
>
> 2) We send out notes to the legacy OOo lists inviting them to join the
> new lists.  The intent was to send two notes.  The first one, which
> you've already seen, gives the background on the migration,
> instructions on how to migrate, but is not especially urgent.  For
> example, we're giving no "drop dead" date on the list shut down.  It
> is an early "head's up".  Honestly,  we don't know the exact shut down
> date yet.  It really depends on Oracle.  When we get a better idea of
> the exact shut down date then we'll send a more urgent note with that
> information.  But it might come with little notice, maybe only a week.
>
> 3) We're also in the progress of migrating over the OOo wiki and
> website.  We're close to completing that.  When that is done we can
> search for all references to the legacy mailing lists and replace them
> with references to the new lists.
>
> 4) We're looking into the possibility of forwarding emails sent to the
> legacy lists to a bot that would automatically respond with a note
> pointing the user to the new lists.  Debate on the ooo-dev list is how
> much we can/should automate this.  If we automate too much, e.g.,
> forwarding all messages, then we're also forwarding the spam, the
> out-of-the-office notices, the "how do I unsubscribe" notes, etc.
> Personally I'd like to leave the spam behind us.
>
>> Question: Should someone ask Oracle for the subscriber list? If we had that
>> list, does Apache policy allow us to subscribe those subscribers to the new
>> Apache lists?
>>
> We've decided to take an opt-in approach, in order to avoid bringing
> over the spammers, but also in recognition of European data protection
> laws.
>
>> Would impact users' mailing filters but some things can't be helped.
>>
> Yes, users will need to update any filters in their mail client.
> That, as well as subscribing to the new list, is a one time task.  I'm
> certain that most users could accomplish both tasks in less time than
> it took you to write your note, or me to respond to it ;-)  Of course,
> some users may have forgotten how they set up their filters initially.
>   But I'm sure if they asked for help on the new list, they would get
> good responses.
>
>
>> Hope you are having a great week!
>>
>> Patrick
>>
>> PS: As an alternative, that is if Apache policy does not allow the mass
>> re-subscription approach, we could view this as an opportunity for some of
>> those interested in ODF to broadcast the move to Apache. Something suitable
>> on the homepages or similar locations of Oracle, IBM, MS and other entities
>> might be a nice touch. A little PR for Apache and getting people to notice
>> the new locations/mailing lists, etc. Something for everyone. (Above my
>> paygrade but the large vendors talk to each other all the time so I leave
>> that conversation up to them.)
>>
> We're trying to publicize it.  I think the most obvious place for
> existing subscribers to hear the news is via a post to the lists.
> That should reach 100% of current list subscribers, right?
>
> We've put other notices up on the home page:
> http://www.openoffice.org    When we get a better indication of the
> exact date for the list shut down it would make sense to get the
> message out there and more broadly.
>
> Regards,
>
> -Rob
>> --
>> Patrick Durusau
>> patrick@durusau.net
>> Chair, V1 - US TAG to JTC 1/SC 34
>> Convener, JTC 1/SC 34/WG 3 (Topic Maps)
>> Editor, OpenDocument Format TC (OASIS), Project Editor ISO/IEC 26300
>> Co-Editor, ISO/IEC 13250-1, 13250-5 (Topic Maps)
>>
>> Another Word For It (blog): http://tm.durusau.net
>> Homepage: http://www.durusau.net
>> Twitter: patrickDurusau
>>
>>
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>>
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>
>


-- 
Patrick Durusau
patrick@durusau.net
Chair, V1 - US TAG to JTC 1/SC 34
Convener, JTC 1/SC 34/WG 3 (Topic Maps)
Editor, OpenDocument Format TC (OASIS), Project Editor ISO/IEC 26300
Co-Editor, ISO/IEC 13250-1, 13250-5 (Topic Maps)

Another Word For It (blog): http://tm.durusau.net
Homepage: http://www.durusau.net
Twitter: patrickDurusau


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