incubator-ooo-dev mailing list archives

Site index · List index
Message view « Date » · « Thread »
Top « Date » · « Thread »
From Ji Yan <yanji...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: AOO volunteers: essential skills and tasks
Date Thu, 01 Nov 2012 08:15:03 GMT
Rob,

  I've submitted "QA introduction" page, pls help commit it. Thanks

2012/11/1 Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>

>
>
> On 10/31/2012 11:36 AM, jan iversen wrote:
>
>> +1 to your 3 layer strategy.
>>
>> I have made a proposal for the wiki page, however I am not competent to
>> fill in the tasks.
>> http://wiki.openoffice.org/w/**index.php?title=Communication/**
>> new_contributors&action=submit<http://wiki.openoffice.org/w/index.php?title=Communication/new_contributors&action=submit>
>>
>> I have NOT linked it in anywhere, but a natural link would in
>> "participation" on the main page.
>>
>> Jan.
>>
>
> OK, I will bail out from this for now, and see what else develops here.
> You know what they say about "too many cooks"... :/
>
> Looking forward to interesting results from both Rob and Jan.
>
> I will certainly help as I see a need.
>
>
>
>> On 31 October 2012 18:59, Rob Weir <robweir@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>>  On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 1:46 PM, jan iversen <jancasacondor@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi.
>>>>
>>>> I think your md pages are SUPER....what I suggested was an additional
>>>>
>>> wiki
>>>
>>>> page (actually someone else called it postoffice) where we put small
>>>>
>>> tasks
>>>
>>>> that need to be translated / written etc.
>>>>
>>>> So I see your pages go hand in hand with Wiki pages, just too different
>>>> levels of interaction with the community.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Right.   So maybe when we do a wider "call for volunteers" we can
>>> offer three tracks:
>>>
>>> 1) Sign up for ooo-dev and "drink from the firehose"  (our only current
>>> option)
>>>
>>> 2) A short intro on the wiki, one that doesn't exist yet, but maybe
>>> someone can write one.
>>>
>>> 3) A longer self-paced intro on the website (what I'm working on)
>>>
>>> They are volunteers, so we can't force them to do anything.  But we
>>> can offer them a few choices.  I'm happy to provide one of those
>>> choices.  Who wants to provide another?
>>>
>>> -Rob
>>>
>>>  jan
>>>>
>>>> On 31 October 2012 16:59, Rob Weir <robweir@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 10/28/2012 04:30 PM, Rob Weir wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 28, 2012 at 6:29 PM, Andrea Pescetti <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> pescetti@apache.org>
>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 23/10/2012 Rob Weir wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> New Volunteer Orientation root page:
>>>>>>>>> http://incubator.apache.org/**openofficeorg/orientation/<http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/orientation/>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This is an excellent resource. But we received a few requests
from
>>>>>>>> prospective volunteers this weekend and I'm believing it
would be
>>>>>>>> overwhelming to point them there. I still believe these documents
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> are
>>>
>>>> excellent, but probably they are assuming our volunteer is above
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> average,
>>>>>
>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>> at least willing to engage deeply with the project. They
would be
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> perfect
>>>>>
>>>>>> for me, for you, or for a newcomer like Jan who has the skills and
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>
>>>> mindset to understand in detail how things work.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And how do we know in advance which volunteers are like Jan and
which
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> are
>>>>>
>>>>>> not?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think we should find some way to point them to the info and
say
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> that
>>>
>>>> they are welcome to jump in and ignore this all, or skim it in
>>>>>>> parallel with direct participation, or read through this stuff
first.
>>>>>>> It is entirely up to them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But generally, the more one needs to interact with other project
>>>>>>> participants and other systems and even other parts of Apache,
the
>>>>>>> more this information becomes useful.   Although not stated,
one
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> could
>>>
>>>> almost say that "Level 4" would be becoming a Committer.  So you are
>>>>>>> correct that this is a track for a more determined volunteer,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  But we will also have (and we do have: most volunteers I see
on the
>>>>>>>> mailing
>>>>>>>> lists in Italian fall in this category) volunteers who don't
care
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> that
>>>
>>>> much
>>>>>>>> about OpenOffice as a project: they use the product and just
want to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> give
>>>>>
>>>>>> something back. They want to scratch an itch, or just to do
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> something,
>>>
>>>> but
>>>>>>>> they are very task-oriented: they want something to do rather
than
>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>> to read. For example, we may have translation volunteers
who would
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> be
>>>
>>>> perfectly satisfied if we e-mail them a PO file and tell them to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> grab
>>>
>>>> POEdit
>>>>>>>> and send the file back; and then they would consider a deeper
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> engagement,
>>>>>
>>>>>> but not earlier.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Translation volunteers are different in many ways, but even there
I
>>>>>>> think we need some solid orientation material.  They won't go
far
>>>>>>> before wondering why they cannot write to Pootle and the website,
but
>>>>>>> others can.  That leads us into discussion of roles at Apache,
etc.
>>>>>>> And we really need to expose them to the Apache License at the
>>>>>>> earliest opportunity.  We do no one any favors if we're passing
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> around
>>>
>>>> PO files via private mail, and receiving translations without any
>>>>>>> public record of contribution.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In any case, this is an issue we've had for a while.  Becoming
a
>>>>>>> Committer is a higher hurdle than is appropriate for most translation
>>>>>>> volunteers, due to iCLA, etc.  The orientation guides did not
create
>>>>>>> this problem, they merely remind us of it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  And indeed they are not totally wrong: knowing how the Apache
Board
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> works
>>>>>
>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>> not needed to be able to translate a press release, or a
few
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> OpenOffice
>>>
>>>> strings, into Italian.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Could it be that we need a "practical" entry point for people
who
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> want
>>>
>>>> to
>>>>>
>>>>>> help and just want to do it immediately? Placing these information
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> at
>>>
>>>> level
>>>>>>>> 3 of the "Volunteer Orientation" seems too much for volunteers
who
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> want
>>>
>>>> to
>>>>>>>> jump in and do something (while, again, the orientation guide
is
>>>>>>>> excellent
>>>>>>>> for a skilled, determined volunteer).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Since "level 3" for translators does not exist yet, it may be
too
>>>>>>> early to say whether or not is "practical".   (I hope it will
be
>>>>>>> practical).  If we make it self-contained, it may be possible
for it
>>>>>>> be consulted on its own for someone who is not seeking deeper
>>>>>>> engagement with the project.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Rob
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Regards,
>>>>>>>>     Andrea.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rob,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I still support this whole notion. But, maybe it would be better
to go
>>>>>>
>>>>> with
>>>>>
>>>>>> more of a "checklist" style instead of the in-depth explanations
you
>>>>>>
>>>>> have in
>>>>>
>>>>>> this document.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What if you ported this to the wiki (Jan suggested this as well.
>>>>>>
>>>>> cwiki is
>>>
>>>> easiest for me but I have no object to wiki.openoffice.org) so those
>>>>>>
>>>>> of
>>>
>>>> us
>>>>>
>>>>>> that are interested can more easily contribute to this worthwhile
>>>>>>
>>>>> guide.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Of course you are free to start whatever wiki page you wish.  But I'll
>>>>> be continuing with the mdtext pages I've started.  This is based on my
>>>>> experience with providing orientation to many of our Symphony
>>>>> developers on how Apache projects work and how to participate in such
>>>>> a community.  This approach works.   Other approaches might work for
>>>>> others as well.  But I'm going to give this a try.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Rob
>>>>>
>>>>>  Thanks for starting this. It is needed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>> ------------
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> MzK
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never
>>>>>>   dealt with a cat."
>>>>>>                                 -- Robert Heinlein
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>
> --
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
> ------------
> MzK
>
> "Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never
>  dealt with a cat."
>                                -- Robert Heinlein
>



-- 


Thanks & Best Regards, Yan Ji

Mime
  • Unnamed multipart/alternative (inline, None, 0 bytes)
View raw message