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From Dave Fisher <>
Subject Re: Graduation timeline: A reminder for project members, press and list observers
Date Sat, 13 Oct 2012 19:36:28 GMT

On Oct 13, 2012, at 11:48 AM, Pedro Giffuni wrote:

> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Rob Weir <>
> ...
>>> As a minor update, the only observation we received so far (besides a
>>> substantial number of +1 votes, no abstentions or -1) was that almost all
>>> the proposed PMC members do not belong to other Apache projects; our 
>> mentors
>>> were asked if they perceived this as a problem, and we didn't get an 
>> answer
>>> from them so far.
>> Hmmm.... I think there are several PMC members who are involved with
>> other areas of Apache:
>> 1) Don is involved with ConCom, as well as working with Sally on Press
>> and Communications.

Don's efforts are visible.
>> 2) Others, like Oliver, Louis, etc., have been active in the ApacheCon planning.
>> 3) Andrew,  Juergen and Raphael have worked closely with Infra on many
>> things.  There may be others.

imacat as well.

All are visible.

>> 4) In general I think we're comfortable working with Trademarks and
>> Legal Affairs on an ongoing basis.  This includes raising questions
>> and getting advice, but some, like Dennis, are active sharing what
>> they have learned as well.
>> 5) Dave is involved with POI.

I was the exception that Bertrand was aware of - we are both Mentors to Apache Flex and I'm
the only Member on the PMC.

>>   Don and Juergen are also on the PMC of
>> the ODF Toolkit. 

I am glad to see your recent attention to ODFToolkit where you are also a PPMC member.

>> I think Pedro said he was getting involved with a
>> new BeanShell project proposal.

I haven't seen that in the Incubator yet.

>> 6) There was the work moving the SPI funds to Apache that involved
>> coordinating with ASF Treasurer.
>> So  I do not know whether it is accurate to say that no one but Dave
>> is "active in more than just the OO project".
> The above is all mostly unrelated. I do think we should have included
> some of our mentors in the PMC.

I agree.

> This was a failure in the method we chose to determine the initial PMC:
> we chose based on project visibility/popularity and by their function our
> mentors have tried to remain with a low profile and intervene only when
> it was absolutely necessary.

There are several ways this may be fixed in no particular order or evaluation of likelihood.

(A) The Board might add PMC members.
(B) The new PMC might VOTE for new PMC members.
(C) Some PMC members might be elected Apache Members at the next Members meeting.

Only one of the above (B) is something that may be controlled by the PMC.

> This is something relatively easy to fix though, let's hope it doesn't delay
> us too much.

I don't see a delay happening. Let's be patient for the next few days.

Best Regards,

> Pedro.

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