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From Kay Schenk <>
Subject Re: AOO volunteers: essential skills and tasks
Date Wed, 31 Oct 2012 23:18:17 GMT

On 10/31/2012 11:36 AM, jan iversen wrote:
> +1 to your 3 layer strategy.
> I have made a proposal for the wiki page, however I am not competent to
> fill in the tasks.
> I have NOT linked it in anywhere, but a natural link would in
> "participation" on the main page.
> Jan.

OK, I will bail out from this for now, and see what else develops here. 
You know what they say about "too many cooks"... :/

Looking forward to interesting results from both Rob and Jan.

I will certainly help as I see a need.

> On 31 October 2012 18:59, Rob Weir <> wrote:
>> On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 1:46 PM, jan iversen <>
>> wrote:
>>> Hi.
>>> I think your md pages are SUPER....what I suggested was an additional
>> wiki
>>> page (actually someone else called it postoffice) where we put small
>> tasks
>>> that need to be translated / written etc.
>>> So I see your pages go hand in hand with Wiki pages, just too different
>>> levels of interaction with the community.
>> Right.   So maybe when we do a wider "call for volunteers" we can
>> offer three tracks:
>> 1) Sign up for ooo-dev and "drink from the firehose"  (our only current
>> option)
>> 2) A short intro on the wiki, one that doesn't exist yet, but maybe
>> someone can write one.
>> 3) A longer self-paced intro on the website (what I'm working on)
>> They are volunteers, so we can't force them to do anything.  But we
>> can offer them a few choices.  I'm happy to provide one of those
>> choices.  Who wants to provide another?
>> -Rob
>>> jan
>>> On 31 October 2012 16:59, Rob Weir <> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Kay Schenk <>
>> wrote:
>>>>> On 10/28/2012 04:30 PM, Rob Weir wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, Oct 28, 2012 at 6:29 PM, Andrea Pescetti <
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> On 23/10/2012 Rob Weir wrote:
>>>>>>>> New Volunteer Orientation root page:
>>>>>>> This is an excellent resource. But we received a few requests
>>>>>>> prospective volunteers this weekend and I'm believing it would
>>>>>>> overwhelming to point them there. I still believe these documents
>> are
>>>>>>> excellent, but probably they are assuming our volunteer is above
>>>> average,
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>> at least willing to engage deeply with the project. They would
>>>> perfect
>>>>>>> for me, for you, or for a newcomer like Jan who has the skills
>> the
>>>>>>> mindset to understand in detail how things work.
>>>>>> And how do we know in advance which volunteers are like Jan and which
>>>> are
>>>>>> not?
>>>>>> I think we should find some way to point them to the info and say
>> that
>>>>>> they are welcome to jump in and ignore this all, or skim it in
>>>>>> parallel with direct participation, or read through this stuff first.
>>>>>> It is entirely up to them.
>>>>>> But generally, the more one needs to interact with other project
>>>>>> participants and other systems and even other parts of Apache, the
>>>>>> more this information becomes useful.   Although not stated, one
>> could
>>>>>> almost say that "Level 4" would be becoming a Committer.  So you
>>>>>> correct that this is a track for a more determined volunteer,
>>>>>>> But we will also have (and we do have: most volunteers I see
on the
>>>>>>> mailing
>>>>>>> lists in Italian fall in this category) volunteers who don't
>> that
>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>> about OpenOffice as a project: they use the product and just
want to
>>>> give
>>>>>>> something back. They want to scratch an itch, or just to do
>> something,
>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>> they are very task-oriented: they want something to do rather
>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>> to read. For example, we may have translation volunteers who
>> be
>>>>>>> perfectly satisfied if we e-mail them a PO file and tell them
>> grab
>>>>>>> POEdit
>>>>>>> and send the file back; and then they would consider a deeper
>>>> engagement,
>>>>>>> but not earlier.
>>>>>> Translation volunteers are different in many ways, but even there
>>>>>> think we need some solid orientation material.  They won't go far
>>>>>> before wondering why they cannot write to Pootle and the website,
>>>>>> others can.  That leads us into discussion of roles at Apache, etc.
>>>>>> And we really need to expose them to the Apache License at the
>>>>>> earliest opportunity.  We do no one any favors if we're passing
>> around
>>>>>> PO files via private mail, and receiving translations without any
>>>>>> public record of contribution.
>>>>>> In any case, this is an issue we've had for a while.  Becoming a
>>>>>> Committer is a higher hurdle than is appropriate for most translation
>>>>>> volunteers, due to iCLA, etc.  The orientation guides did not create
>>>>>> this problem, they merely remind us of it.
>>>>>>> And indeed they are not totally wrong: knowing how the Apache
>>>> works
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>> not needed to be able to translate a press release, or a few
>> OpenOffice
>>>>>>> strings, into Italian.
>>>>>>> Could it be that we need a "practical" entry point for people
>> want
>>>> to
>>>>>>> help and just want to do it immediately? Placing these information
>> at
>>>>>>> level
>>>>>>> 3 of the "Volunteer Orientation" seems too much for volunteers
>> want
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> jump in and do something (while, again, the orientation guide
>>>>>>> excellent
>>>>>>> for a skilled, determined volunteer).
>>>>>> Since "level 3" for translators does not exist yet, it may be too
>>>>>> early to say whether or not is "practical".   (I hope it will be
>>>>>> practical).  If we make it self-contained, it may be possible for
>>>>>> be consulted on its own for someone who is not seeking deeper
>>>>>> engagement with the project.
>>>>>> -Rob
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>     Andrea.
>>>>> Rob,
>>>>> I still support this whole notion. But, maybe it would be better to go
>>>> with
>>>>> more of a "checklist" style instead of the in-depth explanations you
>>>> have in
>>>>> this document.
>>>>> What if you ported this to the wiki (Jan suggested this as well.
>> cwiki is
>>>>> easiest for me but I have no object to so those
>> of
>>>> us
>>>>> that are interested can more easily contribute to this worthwhile
>> guide.
>>>> Of course you are free to start whatever wiki page you wish.  But I'll
>>>> be continuing with the mdtext pages I've started.  This is based on my
>>>> experience with providing orientation to many of our Symphony
>>>> developers on how Apache projects work and how to participate in such
>>>> a community.  This approach works.   Other approaches might work for
>>>> others as well.  But I'm going to give this a try.
>>>> -Rob
>>>>> Thanks for starting this. It is needed.
>>>>> --
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> MzK
>>>>> "Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never
>>>>>   dealt with a cat."
>>>>>                                 -- Robert Heinlein


"Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never
  dealt with a cat."
                                -- Robert Heinlein

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