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From Kay Schenk <kay.sch...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Terms of Service on Forums
Date Sun, 15 Jul 2012 22:00:40 GMT
On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 3:10 PM, Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> On 07/07/2012 09:42 AM, drew wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 2012-07-07 at 12:27 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, Jul 7, 2012 at 11:31 AM, drew <drew@baseanswers.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, 2012-07-05 at 14:01 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Jul 5, 2012 at 1:25 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton
>>>>>
>>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>
>>>  <orcmid>
>>>>>>    This might need to be separated for what the agreement is when
>>>>>> people
>>>>>>    register/subscribe and provide information solicited to accomplish
>>>>>>    that.
>>>>>>      This seems like too broad an umbrella for what happens when
folks
>>>>>>    register versus what happens when accessing sites versus what
>>>>>> happens
>>>>>>    when sending an e-mail somewhere.
>>>>>> </orcmid>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> It would be good to link to the ToU from any registration.  But note
>>>>> that we don't always have that access where it is a shared Apache
>>>>> service, for example CWiki.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nothing in the ToU speaks about emails, so that is red herring.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> A red herring? I don't think so - why should it only be valid if already
>>>> there. The site references our mailing lists and certainly did, likely
>>>> still does, IMO a comment on the public nature of mailing lists is
>>>> really appropriate here.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> The point is this:  a user can contribute to the mailing list without
>>> ever having visited the website.  So posting ToU for the mailing list
>>> on a website is not going to really have any legal or even advisory
>>> effect.    One thing that we could do is put ToU in the confirmation
>>> note we send to new list subscribers.   Or even a link to a
>>> consolidated ToU on the website if that is how we do it.
>>>
>>> In any case, most of the ToU is in the nature of a notice:  we are
>>> telling the user what will are doing, what we can do, and what we will
>>> do under certainly conditions.  The main exception, where we are
>>> demanding something of the user, is if where we require a licence on
>>> their contributions.  So that is the one thing where we cannot be
>>> casual.  If we want to have an incoming licence on contributions that
>>> really needs to be baked into registration systems, list
>>> acknowledgement emails, etc.
>>>
>>
>> Well, I agree that this is a notice - I still feel it would appropriate
>> to mention mailing list.
>>
>> What I've done just now is simply to move your text verbatim to the wiki
>> - I'll add a paragraph for what I think is an apt way to address this.
>> Give a read to that, and if you or anyone else thinks it's just our of
>> place, well, that's why it's a white board, right ;-)
>>
>>
>> //drew
>>
>>>
>>> -Rob
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> I just did a very quick draft mock-up of a new TOU at:
>
> https://cwiki.apache.org/**confluence/display/OOOUSERS/***
> DRAFT*+Terms+of+Use<https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/*DRAFT*+Terms+of+Use>
>
> based on Dennis's original corrections at:
>
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/**show_bug.cgi?id=118518<https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=118518>
>
> IT still seems rather lengthy to me but...
>
> and it needs some additional information (ref URLs) and in what state is
> ASF "incorporated" or registered?
>
> I agree with Drew that perhaps we should mention the mailing lists in some
> way...
>
>
>
> I will work on this more tomorrow sometime and perhaps we can actually fix
> this.
>

oh boy...well duh on me...when trying to track down where people should go
when they think their own copyright has been infringed upon, I came across
this...

 http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/terms.html

already on the incubator web side.

Is there any reason we just can't replace the current "Terms on Use" on
openoffice.org with a link to this? It looks pretty good to me.

Again, no reference to mailing lists -- I'm assuming we only want to
highlight them with respect to validity of information? I don't see any
other reason to throw them in really.

Anyway, having found this other link, I will delete my mockup on the wiki.
No use confusing things further.


> --
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
> ------------
> MzK
>
> "There's no crying in baseball!"
>        -- Jimmy Dugan (Tom Hanks), "A League of Their Own"
>
>
>


-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MzK

"I would rather have a donkey that takes me there
 than a horse that will not fare."
                                          -- Portuguese proverb

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