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From J├╝rgen Schmidt <jogischm...@googlemail.com>
Subject Re: LinuxTag 2012 Berlin
Date Wed, 30 May 2012 13:55:22 GMT
On 5/30/12 3:10 PM, Graham Lauder wrote:
>> Hi,
> 
> Hi Juergen,
> 
> Please excuse if this seems a little abrupt, but I want to the message to be 
> precise. 
> 
>>
>> last week I gave a talk about OpenOffice on the LinuxTag conference in
>> Berlin.
>>
>> The attendance was moderate and I got the bad first slot in the morning
>> 10:00am after the LinuxTag party on Thursday ;-) It was an interesting
>> interruption of my vacation.
>>
>> My main goal was to express that OpenOffice was never dead and the
>> project have found a new home at Apache. I highlighted our achievements
>> and of course our release as important milestone. Presenting our nice
>> download numbers was also a pleasure for me ;-)
> 
> We should stop apologising for being who we are.  

nobody apologized for that and I simply pointed out the facts as I see it.

> We should not use any speaking opportunity allowed us to talk about / put down 
> /  argue about LO.  

I don't have argued against LibreOffice, I respect it and pointed out
that the user will decide in the long term.

> 
> We do not need to mention the rumours of the project's demise, our actions 
> give lie to that, mentioning it merely gives the rumour recognition that it 
> does not deserve.

well the abstract of my talk was submitted several month ago and I made
clear that I will clarify some misunderstandings.

I haven't put too much pressure on this topic and simply highlighted
more the success of AOO.

I was definitly the first and the last time where I have expressed the
difference between both from my point of view.

> 
> We have had a release!  Even to the most nontechy folk that is proof of life.  

agree and I have highlighted this a lot ;-)

> Let's not mention it ever again.  
> 
> 
>>
>> I also expressed my view that
>>
>> OpenOffice.org = Apache OpenOffice
>> go-oo = LibreOffice
>>
>> based on the facts that we own all rights on the name and the domains,
>> the source code. And we have reserved and migrated the whole infra
>> structure... And on www.go-oo.org you can see the relation to LibreOffice.
>>
>> And that not the complete community have moved to LibreOffice.
>>
>> But I have pointed out that it is my personal view ;-)
>>
>> I also pointed out that we don't want to compete with LibreOffice (also
>> my personal opinion) and that our main focus and goal is to provide a
>> good, stable, high quality, free and intuitive office application.
>>
>> A further point was that I tried to express that our users will decide
>> in the future which office they will prefer and that we will focus on
>> our users and their real demand.
>>
>> Based on the discussion after my talk it is clear that many people don't
>> understand the split anymore and would appreciate if both projects would
>> work together. But that is a political question that can't be answered
>> easily. I think with the Apache license we provide a possible basement
>> but the license question is much more complicate for some people.
> 
> The main reason that the post discussion revolved around the LO/AOO 
> relationship is because it sounds like that was what your talk was about.  

I don't think so but I think it is natural that this discussion comes up
again and again. And I haven't said that I have discussed the details on
this topic with anybody.

> 
> If asked then the answer short and to the point: "We have different licenses 
> and we wish them well!"    That's it... no more.  We should not be discussing 
> the detail.  If people need to know, both licenses are published and discussed 
> on a million places on the web.  People can research it there.
> 
> We have different names now, neither project is the original, Sun is gone!  LO 
> is no more a SUSE project than AOO is an IBM project.  Both projects have 
> corporate members.  That's all.  

well that is your personal opinion but not mine. For me it is clear that
AOO = OpenOffice.org. The fact that the project moved to Apache doesn't
change it. And we still download the product from the same website as
before, install it in the same directory, the visible name change is
currently a mix and we support both.

If a project decides to rename it's name it is still the same project,
isn't it?

> 
> We need to move the conversation away from this nonproductive discussion.
> 
> People need to know:
> 
> The AOO community is growing and highly active
I have expressed this a lot

> We have had our first release
I have highlighted this

> Yes our downloads are lower than historical but we did that with virtually 
> zero publicity
but not bad and I highlighted this as well

> We are very close to graduation to being an Apache Top Level Project
> We now have Symphony code moved over
I talked about this as well ;-)

> We will probably have a couple more incremental releases before 4.0
> 
> We have sourceforge onside and other distribution channels are being looked 
> at.
> 
> 4.0 will be killer!
> 
> Those are the messages we need to go out.
> 
> We do not define this project by LO.  We can be a little grateful to LO for
> keeping OOo and ODF out there in the public eye and maintaining our brand 
> recognition, but that does not extend to allowing their brand to intrude into 
> our conversation.
nobody or better I don't do it, I simply pointed out my based on facts.
And again it was the first time that I did it public in talk and it was
of course the last time.

> 
> No more please.  We need to be on message
> 

I am interested to hear from you how you spread the message, where and when.

Juergen


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