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From Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net>
Subject Re: [RELEASE] new DL test...needs review and comments, and probably correction
Date Mon, 30 Apr 2012 18:02:26 GMT

On Apr 30, 2012, at 9:08 AM, Kay Schenk wrote:

> On Mon, Apr 30, 2012 at 5:53 AM, Rob Weir <robweir@apache.org> wrote:
> 
>> On Sun, Apr 29, 2012 at 10:53 PM, Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 3:22 PM, Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On 04/27/2012 01:46 PM, Rob Weir wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 4:31 PM, Andrea Pescetti<pescetti@apache.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Kay Schenk wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Please take a look at and give feedback on a test page for the
new
>>>>>>> /download/index.html page at:
>>>>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/**download/test/index_new_dl.**html<
>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/test/index_new_dl.html>
>>>>>>> Yes, it's a bit strange with lots of nonsense at the top that
I
>> wanted
>>>>>>> you to see, but will of course go away in production.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The page is nice, but it's the concept that leaves me dubious.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> We have another thread
>>>>>> http://comments.gmane.org/**gmane.comp.apache.incubator.**
>>>>>> ooo.devel/16219<
>> http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.comp.apache.incubator.ooo.devel/16219>
>>>>>> where there seems to be consensus towards a solution that:
>>>>>> 1) Uses SF (and possibly Apache) for the web-based downloads
>>>>>> 2) Does not phase out MirrorBrain, and uses it for the updates (i.e.,
>>>>>> downloads initiated by OpenOffice with the "Look for updates"
>> function)
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> That's what I understand as well.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> oh -- OK. I thought we were going to use MirrorBrain for 3.3 DLs as well
>>>> -- i.e. what Marcus will be working on. I know right now, we're using
>>>> SourceForge for that though.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> The "possibly Apache" in 1) is due to the fact that I haven't
>> understood
>>>>>> yet
>>>>>> what technology Apache will be using and if Apache will distribute
>> only
>>>>>> sources or binaries too (it's obvious that we as a project will
>> release
>>>>>> sources and binaries, but I'm not 100% sure that Apache wants to
put
>>>>>> binaries on its mirrors too: I think so).
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> Well it's not all that complicated actually. Take a look at the security
>>>> patch info page...
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/**security/cves/CVE-2012-0037.**html<
>> http://www.openoffice.org/security/cves/CVE-2012-0037.html>
>>>> 
>>>> and you can see what the link looks like.
>>>> 
>>>> Actual source/binaries are, for us, put in:
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.apache.org/dist/**incubator/ooo/<
>> http://www.apache.org/dist/incubator/ooo/>
>>>> 
>>>> This said, you could be right in having issues tracking down problems.
>>>> Right now, the SF setup is more "user friendly" in my opinion. I
>> thought we
>>>> were *required* to use Apache for downloads, but maybe we've gotten a
>>>> dispensation for this release. Though I didn't think is was 100%
>> someplace
>>>> else. I admit I haven't kept up as much as I should have though.
>>>> 
>>>> The other issue is how will it LOOK to users -- one moment they may be
>> one
>>>> place; if they happen to do a shift-reload, they may go someplace else
>> with
>>>> an entirely different look and feel.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>>> Fact is, we should avoid the random selection as much as possible,
>>>>>> mainly to
>>>>>> be able to quickly identify problems, and you will see details in
that
>>>>>> thread. The cleaner separation we can get, the better.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> So how about something very simple:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 1) AOO 3.4 downloads use SourceForge by default from the
>>>>> /download/index.html page.  Just like they are doing today.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> This WOULD make things a lot simpler.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> But we also have a links there that point to Apache mirrors for:
>>>>> 
>>>>> a) Hashes and detached signatures
>>>>> b) source distribution
>>>>> c) a link to the full release tree
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Well, SF will need to implement in their sidebar or the main page for
>>>> openoffice.org they have, right?
>>>> 
>>>> Anyway, good conversation.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> In other words, no rolling the dice, noting fancy.  100% of normal
>>>>> users will download from SF.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 2) When we enable the automated updates, in a week or two, then we
>>>>> decide what we want to do.  Maybe we do it via SF.  Maybe MirrorBrain.
>>>>> Maybe a mix,
>>>>> 
>>>>> On the other side, release time is approaching and I can only hope
>> that
>>>>>> talks between Peter Poeml (MirrorBrain author) and Apache Infra,
that
>> had
>>>>>> started on this list, are progressing now.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>> I think it is too late for any of those talks to influence how we deal
>>>>> with AOO 3.4 initial downloads.  But maybe the update downloads in a
>>>>> couple of weeks.
>>>>> 
>>>>> -Rob
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Andrea.
>>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>>> ------------
>>>> MzK
>>>> 
>>>> "Well, life has a funny way of sneaking up on you
>>>> And life has a funny way of helping you out
>>>> Helping you out."
>>>>                           -- "Ironic", Alanis Morissette
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Ok, I am hoping this will be about the last, final review on the new
>>> download/index.html --
>>> 
>>> prototype at:
>>> 
>>> http://ooo-site.staging.apache.org/download/test/index_new_dl.html
>>> 
>>> This assumes SourceForge ONLY, and that the  3.4 pre-built client packs
>>> will be in the hiearchy as the 3.3 is -- stable, etc.
>>> 
>>> Naturally NONE of the links will work until something gets out there and
>>> there is a TON of alerts which I will of course eventually comment out.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> It suddenly dawned on me *just today* that we don't want to continue to
>>> generate links for OSes we no longer support now, like Sun's retinue, and
>>> for some reason because of how this all operates, it took me forever to
>> fix
>>> this one aspect.  I could have not bothered with this but well, I didn't
>>> want to lead folks astray with a "not found" -- so they will now get sent
>>> to "other.html".
>>> 
>>> So, please test with what you've got and I hope for ALL platforms that we
>>> do support, you get a link that looks to be correct.
>>> 
>> 
>> The link looks good for me, including the trailing "/download" that
>> SourceForge needs.
>> 
>> A few things:
>> 
>> 1) Text should be 'Apache OpenOffice' not 'OpenOffice.org'
>> 
> 
> Ok-- I did miss this...
> 
>> 
>> 2) Google Analytics needs to enable on the page.
>> 
> 
> OK, I'll add this...
> 
> 
>> 
>> 3) We need to get a link to the source code in there someplace.
>> 
> 
> again, OK, I'll add to the "options" box below the main light green BIG DL
> area
> 
> 
>> 
>> 4) The original page had a link for extensions and templates.  The new
>> one only has extensions.  Was this intentional?
>> 
> 
> Hmmm...OK,  maybe I started out with an older copy and templates got added
> later. I will add this section.
> 
> 
>> 
>> Otherwise, it looks good!
>> 
>> I can help with some of these, especially #2, but I'll wait to see if
>> there are any bigger changes first.
>> 
> 
> ok, good...
> 
> I will make these mods today and post another revision -- maybe even
> without the "alerts" if I'm feeling more confident! :/
> 
> 
>> 
>> -Rob
>> 
>> 
>>> ps. I'm assuming that we will house the actual "source" artifact from
>>> Apache and this will show up in other.html as well when someone provides
>>> this information.
>> 
> 
> OK, I see Jurgen's message on this one...Apache instructions say NOT to use
> a direct link to "/dist" so I'll sue closer.cgi on source link only and
> hope for the best.
> 
> 
> onward and upward...

I'll help with closer.cgi.

I believe that the Source code download should be on the project site and we should link to
it from the download page. This will help separate concerns.

Regards,
Dave


> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> MzK
>>> 
>>> "Well, life has a funny way of sneaking up on you
>>> And life has a funny way of helping you out
>>> Helping you out."
>>>                           -- "Ironic", Alanis Morissette
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> MzK
> 
> "Well, life has a funny way of sneaking up on you
> And life has a funny way of helping you out
> Helping you out."
>                            -- "Ironic", Alanis Morissette


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