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From Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net>
Subject Re: [WWW] Feedback/"contact us" about the website link needed...
Date Sun, 19 Feb 2012 23:23:25 GMT

On Feb 19, 2012, at 3:03 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:

> On Sun, Feb 19, 2012 at 11:12 AM, Dave Fisher <dave2wave@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Kay,
>> 
>> On Feb 17, 2012, at 2:17 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
>> 
>>> OK, update on this...a contact us page is now available at:
>>> http://www.openoffice.org/contact_us.html
>>> 
>>> It is VERY simple and I did what I could for incorporating the use of our
>>> existing Bug gateway (which I also made changes to in an attempt to cover
>>> the existing Bugzilla categories. As with all of the ooo-site, anyone
>> with
>>> comitter rights can make changes.
>>> 
>>> Dave, please incorporate into the footer if you're doing seem editing on
>>> that as you see fit. Having a link next to the Copyright and Licenses
>> seems
>>> fine though that is followed by a paragraph specifically related to that.
>> 
>> 
>>> 
>>> My preference would be to have "Contact Us" centered immediately below
>> the
>>> footer line if possible.
>> 
>> I've rearranged the header and the publishing sledgehammer is running now.
>> 
>> Centered "Copyrights & License | Contact Us" link.
>> Space
>> Trademark statement
>> Space
>> Incubation statement.
>> 
> 
> SUPER! I'm just a bit of a chicken at messing with the footers and header!
> :/

I'm working on fixing things.

Regards,
Dave

> 
> 
>>> 
>>> Have fun!
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 1:48 PM, Louis Suárez-Potts <
>>>> lsuarezpotts@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Hi
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 10 February 2012 18:52, Kay Schenk <kay.schenk@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 12:30 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton <
>>>>>> dennis.hamilton@acm.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I agree with Kay that one reason someone may want to contact
us is
>>>>> because
>>>>>>> there is a problem with the web site itself.  I also think that
going
>>>>>>> directly to the mailing list page is perhaps too abrupt.  Some
free
>>>>>>> analysis from the top of orcmid's head:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> yes, really, this was my intention -- but I think Rob's calrification
>>>>> would
>>>>>> work  for that. I started wondering about this in light of the recent
>>>>>> communication re that bad link. How long did it take Rick to figure
>> out
>>>>> who
>>>>>> to contact, etc. (I also know we need to get going with some
>> reasonable
>>>>>> analysis tool to tract these down *beforehand* if we can) . I didn't
>>>>> mean
>>>>>> for this to be a "user centric" catchall.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I can certainly understand the value of a User centric FAQ in this
>>>>> regard.
>>>>>> And we may even have one!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> For issues about the site(s) itself, I think a bottom-of-page
link is
>>>>>>> fine.  It might go to another web page that refines the contact
based
>>>>> on
>>>>>>> particular cases (two that should always be prominent and
>>>>> straightforward
>>>>>>> are for the site and for anything to do with security concerns
-- but
>>>>> not
>>>>>>> directly to ooo-security.).
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> With user issues, taking people directly to bugzilla is effectively
a
>>>>>>> giant FU for ordinary users.  A bullet item that links to how
to file
>>>>> a bug
>>>>>>> and also links directly to bugzilla is good, so experts don't
have to
>>>>> do
>>>>>>> the drill-down.  (Might need a branch for those needing a bugzilla
>>>>> account
>>>>>>> too.) [Something like this might help refine the security case
as
>>>>> well.]
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I think you're right on this one. BZ is too daunting jut to report
a
>>>>> link
>>>>>> problem unless we can implement a nicer front end to BZ just for
these
>>>>>> cases. I will be happy to investigate this. We may even be able to
do
>> a
>>>>>> "proxy login" of some sort.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Then I think there can be explanation that all other support
is peer
>>>>>>> support from other users and developer volunteers, with some
>> indication
>>>>>>> about the options (wiki, forums, web site, mailing-list
>> subscriptions,
>>>>> and
>>>>>>> bugzilla) and how to search/explore/choose among them.  This
would
>>>>> probably
>>>>>>> be right after something about web site issues and security concerns.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Third tier on some of these might be FAQ that provide more detail
and
>>>>> help
>>>>>>> users address common concerns.  (I.e., what to do when an AV
product
>>>>> says
>>>>>>> their download is infected, what the project does to ensure the
>>>>> integrity
>>>>>>> of binaries and how to find those to be confident in them, how
to
>> check
>>>>>>> their authenticity, etc.  That's been going around lately.)
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Finally, of course, there is always the welcoming of those who
might
>>>>> want
>>>>>>> to themselves contribute to an aspect that is a concern or interest
>> for
>>>>>>> them.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> yes... :) I hope this is reasonably covered in the revisions to the
>>>>> "Help
>>>>>> Wanted" page I made, but, of course, it's an ongoing process.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I suppose I should put myself in this last category, although
I am
>> not
>>>>>>> prepared to figure out how to work on such a page [set]. Sorry.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> - Dennis
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Thanks for the feedback from everyone, I will investigate options
>>>>> further.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: Kay Schenk [mailto:kay.schenk@gmail.com]
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, February 10, 2012 09:43
>>>>>>> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WWW] Feedback/"contact us" about the website link
>>>>> needed...
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 9, 2012 at 4:46 PM, Rob Weir <robweir@apache.org>
wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> [ ... ]
>>>>>>>> Another way to think of it:  99.99% of the time, if a user
actually
>>>>>>>> needs to contact us, then the website has failed its purpose.
 We
>> can
>>>>>>>> only handle 100 million users if, for the vast majority of
cases,
>>>>> they
>>>>>>>> can self-support themselves via the website's navigation
and find
>>>>> what
>>>>>>>> they want.  So the challenge here is to handle the exceptional
0.01%
>>>>>>>> of cases, without becoming the path of least resistance for
the
>> other
>>>>>>>> 99.99%.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> -Rob
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Rob--
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I understand what you're saying, believe me. I guess I feel we
should
>>>>>>> provide an easier avenue for people to report problems with the
site
>>>>>>> itself. I'm also aware that if I just put in a simple link with
a
>>>>> "mailto"
>>>>>>> tag, many folks won't be able to deal with that because they
won't
>>>>> have a
>>>>>>> "default" e-mail client.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> How about a "Contact Us" link that directs them to our existing
>>>>> "Mailing
>>>>>>> List" page --
>>>>>>> http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/mailing-lists.html.
>>>>>>> We could add a bit more description to the "Development Mailing
List"
>>>>> to
>>>>>>> indicate that it would be used for submitting questions/problems
>> about
>>>>> the
>>>>>>> web site.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Or do you think it would be best to direct them to BZ?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Briefly: the Contact Us link usually went to me, in OOo. The traffic
>>>>> can be high or low; low if one does it right, and routes people
>>>>> appropriately. Basic rules apply: you don't answer "how-to" questions,
>>>>> unless you are a masochist. You answer the other, much fewer in
>>>>> number, questions.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Hi Louis-- and thanks for this response. For now, I was going to set
>> this
>>>> up as a "portal" for dealing with web site issues ONLY -- the link will
>> be
>>>> called "Report Problems with the Web Site", taking users to an landing
>> page
>>>> that  will initially search for all "issues" in BZ related to the web
>> site,
>>>> so the user can see what's already been reported, and optionally, add
>> to an
>>>> existing issue or create a new one.
>>>> 
>>>> But...it might be a good idea to also include some mention of the
>>>> "Support" page  on this intermediate BZ landing/search page. This should
>>>> take care of a great portion of the support issues. Good suggestion!
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> I volunteer to continue in the role I've grown mossy over.
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks. I'm just going to set this up for BZ as previously suggested.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> I also think that IFF we are intending to replicate some of the
>>>>> friendly to endusers approach of the old OOo, then we would do well to
>>>>> emulate some of the pages we had:
>>>>> 
>>>>> * FAQ on simple things, like where to go with issues *using* OOo and
>>>>> also *building* and "developing* it. We already have much of that, so
>>>>> this would just be links.
>>>>> 
>>>>> * Support page: I think the old support page can simply, as is already
>>>>> being done, be updated and pruned. (Drew is on this, I believe?)
>>>>> 
>>>>> * License  and trademark issues: this was the more difficult one and
>>>>> merits for attention, at least for the more difficult questions.
>>>>> Others are routine, and we've discussed this already here.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Further along these lines: Even if we are not plunging into minimally
>>>>> addressing users (and I think we ought not to shift our shape so to
>>>>> max unless we actually want to), we will be dealing with the
>>>>> media--professional as well as "citizen" journalists. Having, as we
>>>>> had before, a "press kit," done in accordance with Apache, will help
>>>>> both us and any member of the fourth estate.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Louis
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> 
>>>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> MzK
>>>> 
>>>> "Follow your bliss."
>>>>        -- attributed to Joseph Campbell
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> MzK
>>> 
>>> "Follow your bliss."
>>>        -- attributed to Joseph Campbell
>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> MzK
> 
> "Follow your bliss."
>         -- attributed to Joseph Campbell


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