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From Joe Schaefer <>
Subject Re: Updates: IBM Lotus Symphony, Apache OpenOffice, IBM Docs and other fun stuff
Date Thu, 26 Jan 2012 16:39:17 GMT
----- Original Message -----

> From: Raphael Bircher <>
> To:
> Cc: 
> Sent: Thursday, January 26, 2012 11:29 AM
> Subject: Re: Updates: IBM Lotus Symphony, Apache OpenOffice, IBM Docs and other fun stuff
> Am 26.01.12 16:53, schrieb Rob Weir:

>>  I never said that someone with corporate sponsorship is a volunteer.
>>  What I did is challenge you on your belief that this distinction --
>>  the form of reward a participant receives --  makes any difference
>>  whatsoever in terms of how we work on the project. Some members might
>>  be Irishmen, Lutherans or fans of Real Madrid.  These affiliations, as
>>  well as employment status,  are just some of the many attributes of
>>  our personhood.  We should be dealing with each other as persons,
>>  looking at individual actions, rather than drawing wild stereotypes
>>  based on speculated group characteristics.
> That's not realy true Rob. I think IBM employee will also speak up for 
> IBM Interests here. But thats normal, and this is not bad. Also a load 
> of "Volunteers" speek not only for them self. Remember, many has also 
> commercial interrests. I have nothing against IBM. but don't tell me 
> that they speak up all only as individual. For this reason it's good to 
> know what people do in the rest of there life. So you understand same 
> positions better.

At the ASF it is expected that you wear your Apache hat first and foremost.
Most people are able to recognize conflicts of interest and in those circumstances
should recuse themselves.  But IBM doesn't appear to be conflicted about
it's involvement in this project, and that they are willing to dedicate
resources to it at this point should be a welcome change.

Most working groups at IBM do a very respectable job of constructive engagement
with Apache projects, and I expect nothing less from the team Rob and company
assemble here.  But they should be viewed as part of the mix now, no different
than Pedro or any other volunteers save for their own personal motivations for
getting (and staying) involved.  We tend not to question people's rationales for
constructive participation beyond assuming "enlightened self-interest" is behind
what drives them.  At the end of the day it is the collective decision-making of
the entire PPMC that will shape the direction of this project, not IBM management.


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