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From: "Dennis E. Hamilton" <dennis.hamilton@acm.org>
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Subject: RE: [DISCUSS]+[VOTE] Trademark and Branding
Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2011 12:02:03 -0800
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At risk of creating a self-fulfilling prophecy about the length of this =
thread, I want to offer a mild disagreement.

Here, there is pontification about a discussion that wasn't even held =
here.  The interpretations have no ground.

It might be interesting to have the discussion where the discussion =
happened,
<http://user.services.openoffice.org/en/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3D49&t=3D45=
224>. =20

However, I don't think it matters there.  There were misunderstandings =
of fact about how [VOTE] works and what is counted and what is decisive. =
 They were not corrected in time and that might have had some not =
express their preference here.  Who knows how many such determinations =
were made in silence by someone somewhere, completely unrelated to the =
Forum thread.

And our postulating the unfortunate situation of shut-outs where the =
shut-outs don't see it is particularly weird. =20

Now, whether ooo-dev is the lesser for their not having raised the =
questions, fears, disdain, and concerns here, I cannot assess.  It =
didn't happen that way. =20

 - Dennis

PS: I wholeheartedly agree that all of us are enriched by increasing =
participation of Forum volunteers here on ooo-dev, on ooo-user, on the =
wiki, etc.  I am heartened that the subject [VOTE] encouraged some of =
that.  I think it also needs to be accepted that many topics on ooo-dev =
are not of interest, just as Forum threads may be uninteresting to those =
who participate on ooo-dev for other reasons.  This is a broad, diverse =
community.  Having the Forums under the incubator umbrella is a great =
reminder of that.

-----Original Message-----
From: TJ Frazier [mailto:tjfrazier@cfl.rr.com]=20
Sent: Thursday, November 17, 2011 11:22
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [DISCUSS]+[VOTE] Trademark and Branding

Hi, Rory,

On 11/17/2011 13:47, Rory O'Farrell wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Nov 2011 13:07:37 -0500
> Rob Weir<robweir@apache.org>  wrote:
>
>
>> My point was that these volunteers, by not posting on ooo-dev,
>> shut themselves out of the debate.  They are grumbling about
>> their votes not counting.  I think they should be more
>> concerned about their views not being heard because their
>> self-imposed exclusion from the larger project discussions on
>> ooo-dev.  A vote is just a vote.  It is worth little.   But
>> having a well-argued point of view posted in the right place,
>> that is worth much.
>
> I think at this stage there is little point in discussion about
> what has happened.  The result is sufficiently decisive on either
> the overall votes or the PPMC votes that it can now be referred
> to Apache legal and trademarking for a decision, either on the
> main choice, or if this proves unacceptable for some legal reason,
> a clear alternative.
>
If we were a well-established and long-functioning group, I would agree=20
with you 100% about excessive postmortems. But, we aren't. This sort of=20
thing is both necessary and informative =E2=80=93 as long as we don't =
create a=20
thread longer than the [VOTE]! ;-)

--=20
/tj/