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From Devin Han <devin...@apache.org>
Subject Re: [tdf-discuss] ODF and HTML 5
Date Fri, 07 Oct 2011 13:32:30 GMT
Interesting!
I also submit a proposal about ODF and HTML5(
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=12957), but no positive
response...


2011/10/4 Dennis E. Hamilton <dennis.hamilton@acm.org>

> My apologies for the heavy-duty cross-posting.  It might be good to pick a
> single public list and a subject header and converge there.
>
> Q: WHERE IS THE PROPOSAL?
>
> This started as a simple e-mail list question by Jaime R. Garza on the
> [tdf-discuss] list:
> <http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/msg07698.html>.
>
> There is no proposal in the sense of some technical submission to adapt ODF
> for this purpose.  You are pretty much seeing the extent of the discussion
> so far.  The proposal is a paragraph and concept being echoed around these
> lists now.
>
> Q: WHERE TO BECOME INVOLVED IN ODF IN HTML5?
>
> There are probably two ways to be involved.
>
> First, development of a proof-of-concept and working [reference]
> implementation is valuable.
>
> Secondly, the development of necessary specifications, perhaps jointly
> between the OASIS ODF TC and the W3C, might be required.
>
> Also, one needs to differentiate between making some sort of
> OpenOffice.org/LibreOffice deliverable that works in HTML5 and a worked
> extension of HTML5 that somehow ties into the ODF Format.
>
> It might not even make technical sense to "make ODF part of HTML5," and
> that has to be resolved also.
>
> Q: WHAT ABOUT OASIS (and what does Rob Weir have to say about this)?
>
> Rob is on vacation this week.  I know he and others involved on the OASIS
> TCs are interested in this topic.
>
> A related topic (defining HTML5 presentation of ODF documents) was raised
> at the OASIS ODF Interoperability and Conformance (OIC TC) on their
> 2011-09-07 teleconference call:
> <http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/oic/201109/msg00009.html>.  It came
> under section 3.2.3 Profiles.  The discussion is of a Web Profile for ODF.
>  That is not an insignificant effort.
>
> Q: WHAT ARE THE TECHNICAL CHALLENGES?
>
>   ODF has no rendering model and certainly not an
> interactive-presentation/-editing model.  None.  Obviously,
> OpenOffice.org/LibreOffice do, but those is not to be found in the ODF
> specification.
>
> There are an insignificant number of [X]HTML-isms in the ODF
> specifications.  XLINK is used, for example.
>
> There is no specified mapping to [X]HTML.  If there were, the import/export
> of [X]HTML in various implementations of ODF-bases software would presumable
> work better.  That would be the potential subject matter of a Web Profile
> though.
>
> There is no standardized ODF DOM (and API) nor a mapping of ODF into an
> HTML[5] DOM.  Somehow, to make macros and applets work inside ODF, something
> like this is required as well, although having it fit HTML5 as well might be
> a confusion of abstraction levels.  (The integration of macros and applets
> that access the interior structure and external presentation of an ODF
> document is implementation-defined in ODF 1.2.)
>
> Q: WHERE CAN TECHNICAL DEVELOPMENT HAPPEN?
>
> The ODF Toolkit project offers some DOM implementations, but they are not
> part of ODF itself.
>
> The ODF Toolkit project is currently being moved to Apache though.  That
> project is currently quite Java-centric.  It might be interesting to include
> that effort in this conversation, however.
>
> If a public reference implementation were to be developed, I believe it is
> desirable to have it be Apache licensed, wherever development were to occur.
>  The possibility of a new podling at Apache specifically for this effort
> should not be overlooked.
>
> That is the only political part that I see to these challenges, apart from
> developers, including in private projects, wanting to do it themselves.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jaime R. Garza [mailto:garzaj@gmail.com]
> <http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/msg07708.html>
> <
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201110.mbox/%3cCAJGN0paeBoKS7HTqpc0waW_qRJgcxEZr-rk+63MMBuBsCe-Xxg@mail.gmail.com%3e
> >
>
> Sent: Monday, October 03, 2011 03:29
> To: discuss@documentfoundation.org
> Cc: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [tdf-discuss] ODF and HTML 5
>
> Do you have any contacts, links, infos about the proposal and status? I
> would really like to get involved!
>
> I think the first step is to integrate ODF into HTML5 as read only, editing
> could come later. But this is more political than technical.
>
> Cheers!
>
> Jaime
>
> On Mon, Oct 3, 2011 at 11:07, Ian Lynch <ianrlynch@gmail.com> wrote:
> < http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/msg07705.html>
> <
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201110.mbox/%3cCAOap24+y0rFCOA78YFHTLMURQ5LO4OJ7aaLyi3HP0rtFm-2EOw@mail.gmail.com%3e
> >
>
> > There has been a proposal to try and get ODF recognised as an official
> > extension of HTML5. On the face of it it sounds a good idea but I
> > don't know enough about the details or whether this is already in
> > progress. I guess it would require discussion with W3C, OASIS, and
> > probably TDF and ASF as a minimum. A logical technical need could be
> > to develop ODF rendering and editing in web browsers. To start with
> > this might simply be a limited subset of what can be achieved in
> > OO/LibO.
> > --
> > Ian
> [ ... ]
>
>


-- 
-Devin

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