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From "Dennis E. Hamilton" <orc...@apache.org>
Subject [VOTE][DISCUSS] Acceptance of the OpenOffice.org Proposal - Inclusiveness
Date Tue, 18 Oct 2011 23:43:05 GMT
Thanks Ross, I wish to correct what I have done:

THE IMPORTANT PART

Please, anyone: If you wish to have your preference known concerning this 
proposal, please cast a vote.  It establishes a sense of what overall 
participation in ooo-dev and others think concerning the acceptance of the 
proposal.  The PPMC will definitely pay attention, as will all observers. 
That's an important contribution available to all who receive this message.

Note that I have changed this message to the [VOTE][DISCUSS] where anyone is 
welcome to speak up on the voting itself.  Please use the [VOTE] thread for 
voting, the way that all voters have done so far.

 - Dennis

BACKGROUND ON HOW THE APPROACH WAS TAKEN

I thought it important to provide the distinction around binding votes because 
this is not on a private list where all votes are clear.  My model was the 
vote held on general@incubator.apache.org as part of the acceptance of 
OpenOffice.org as an Apache podling.  That is my only experience of a [P]PMC 
Vote conducted on a public discussion list.

With regard to listing the PPMC: The PPMC roster is not currently visible 
outside of the PPMC.  It seemed important for others to have a sense of who 
this Project Management Committee is.  I think it is rather a mystery for the 
OpenOffice.org Forum operators and also many other ooo-dev visitors.  There is 
consensus to list the PPMC on the OpenOffice.org Incubator Status page. I 
though it useful to make the roster available earlier in conjunction with this 
event.

I regret any suggestion that anyone's vote is unimportant. I apologize.  All 
votes will be tallied.  In presenting the results, I will differentiate the 
PPMC-cast votes.  I did not want to surprise someone who was expecting some 
different way of determining the outcome.  This is not straw poll. It is a 
vote of the PPMC to accept a proposal on behalf of the project.  I suppose it 
is a PPMC vote with a straw poll of all of the ooo-dev subscribers and other 
posters thrown in.

Please, anyone: If you wish to have your preference known concerning this 
proposal, please cast a vote.  It establishes a sense of what overall 
participation in ooo-dev and others think concerning the acceptance of the 
proposal.  The PPMC will definitely pay attention, as will all observers. 
That's an important contribution available to all who receive this message.

 - Dennis





-----Original Message-----
From: Ross Gardler [mailto:rgardler@opendirective.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2011 15:51
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: How voting works...

I'm not going to dig into all the details of how a vote is called in the ASF.

In posting this I am not asking for the current vote to be recalled,
there is no need.

I am just wanting to flag something that concerns me about how the
vote was called (and as per usual this is just advice from a mentor,
these are not rules that must be adopted).

In an ASF community everyone is entitled to an opinion. Everyone
should be encouraged to express that opinion in a formal vote, just as
much as they should be encouraged to express their opinions in day to
day discussion.

It is true that only some members of the community have binding votes.
However, this only becomes important in the event of an absence of
community consensus.

Therefore, when calling a vote please do not word it in such a way
that implies others in the community do not have a vote that counts.
It does count. A responsible PPMC member will use their own vote to
support any appropriate objections from the community. They can only
do that if the community is encouraged to express their views
alongside everyone else..

Specifically, there is no need to define binding votes in the vote
thread, the way Apache Projects vote is well documented and, over
time, the AOOo project will gain its own guidelines. Secondly, do not
list the people who are "important" enough to have a binding vote.
Thirdly, explicitly call for all community members to express their
preferences in the vote.

In other words, make every action of the PPMC as inclusive as possible.

Finally, Denis - thank you for calling the vote.

Ross

-- 
Ross Gardler (@rgardler)
Programme Leader (Open Development)
OpenDirective http://opendirective.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2011 11:56
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: RE: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Acceptance of the OpenOffice.org Proposal

Dave, thanks for your questions.

My reading as the initiator of the [VOTE]:

The vote is solely on the acceptance of the proposal.  The proposal is the
text so identified on the OOOUSER web page.

Actions that are called for require their own execution, including further
discussion as needed.  Finally, personnel matters are not discussed here or
voted on here ever, as far as I know.  In any case, it is not part of this
vote.  I recommend that no such discussion occur here.

Likewise, there is nothing in the statement of the vote that suggests who will
do what, regardless of table-talk to that effect.  It is not part of the
ballot measure.

 - Dennis

-----Original Message-----
From: Dave Fisher [mailto:dave2wave@comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2011 09:54
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [VOTE][DISCUSS] Acceptance of the OpenOffice.org Proposal

When voting for the proposal are we (or are we not) voting for "Initial
Committers / PMC"

Rory O'Farrell - RoryOF - ofarrwrk at iol.ie

Ricardo Gabriel Berlasso - RGB-es on the Spanish forums (Admin) - rgb dot mldc
at gmail dot com

If I am not mistaken that formality needs to occur on ooo-private as a
separate process. I have started a [DISCUSS] thread there. Normally a DISCUSS
/ VOTE on ooo-private is NOT discussed in public. I think an exception should
be made here to assure the community that the whole of the proposal is being
fairly "processed" by the PPMC.

Regards,
Dave

On Oct 18, 2011, at 9:27 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:

> In reply to this message on ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org, vote for the
> acceptance of the proposal for governance and operation of the
> OpenOffice.org
> Forums within the Apache OpenOffice.org Podling.  The Proposal text is at
> the
> October 12 version of wiki page
> <https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/Changes+integrate+the+forums+into+the+AOOo+project>.
>
> The balloting will end midnight Friday, 2011-10-21T24:00Z, over 72 hours
> from
> now.
>
> A majority of approvals over disapprovals constitutes acceptance of the
> proposal.
>
> [  ] +1 approve
> [  ]  0 abstain
> [  ] -1 disapprove, for the following reasons:
>
>
> GUIDELINES
>
> ANYONE MAY VOTE.  BINDING VOTES for determining the outcome are those cast
> by
> any of the 54 PPMC members (to be listed in a separate message).  When the
> same individual casts more than one vote, the last-dated vote during the
> ballot period is taken as the final vote from that individual.  Votes made
> anywhere but as replies to the ooo-dev list with this subject are not
> counted.
>
> DO NOT DISCUSS THE VOTING ON THIS THREAD.  This thread is for the votes
> themselves, including explanations for -1 votes.  Any other discussion
> related
> to this ballot, including discussions with anyone about their vote, should
> be
> on a separate threat with subject beginning [VOTE][DISCUSS].
>
>
> - Dennis E. Hamilton
>   tools for document interoperability,  <http://nfoWorks.org/>
>   dennis.hamilton@acm.org  gsm: +1-206-779-9430  @orcmid
>
>

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