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Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2011 22:47:31 +0200
From: "Marcus (OOo)" <marcus.mail@wtnet.de>
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To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Iaccessible2 in OOo
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Am 09/28/2011 03:47 PM, schrieb Jean-Philippe MENGUAL:
> Hi,
>
> Very interesting answer, thanks:
>
>>
>> I say 'potentially' as the developers in the community will make it a
>> priority if, and only if, it is clear there is a strong demand for IA2
>> and someone leads the work and use of it. So I would encourage you to
>> continue your work of letting us know of the need and also suggest you
>> guide other users and developers who require IA2 support in AOO  to
>> join in the discussion here. A good approach would be to get folks to
>> blog about why it is important and we can post links here. That way
>> the AOO community will be encouraged to work on ensuring there is an
>> open and accessible Office suite available for Windows. In fact there
>> may eventually be even more choice for users if AOO becomes the core
>> used by other projects, as indeed it has the potential to be.
>
> I will try doing that. But I'd like to mention one problem and several elements which make me think I represent an enormous part of users who want IA2 to be integrated. The problem is that I have feedbacks essentially from France or French-speaking people, and they decided me to be intermediate between English-speaking community and them. So, they have difficulties to write here directly. The language is a problem for the major part of them.
>
> However, several things make me think there's a large demand:
> - In the public administrations in France, where OOo is choosen, we have thousands of people who work and who are blind or sight-impaired;
> - The workgroup "Accessibilit� et logiciel libre" (A11y and Free software), from April (the main French organization which Promote the Free Software in France) asked for this evolution. It appeared in our "bug tracker" (used to enable not English-speaking users to report problems so that we forward, as I do now). 4 bugs appear about this issue.
> - The LibreOffice project expressed the desire to wait for AOOo integration to integrate itself IA2 in their utility.
> - The problems with OOo are very often denounced on French mailing list of blind people (for instance, ALLOS mailing list).
> - The CFPSAA, an official enormous organization which defends the blind people rights, published, this June, a newsletter where they explained that migrating a desktop to OOo was a mistake as it's not accessible (it's a pitty! ). I tried answering and communicating about this, but of course if such official organization has this approach, it proves the need.
> - I met 60 people in France IRL a few weeks ago, to show them what free software gives to accessibility. The cain problem where I had to fight was OOo.
>
>
> Anyway I'll forward your appeal, but I'd like you to know that even if I'm alone to write, it's a time and language problem. But thousands of people asked me to do that. It's really major, that's why I try speaking directly to the dev today. Because when that is fixed, a major limitation will be removed to migrating to Free software with NVDA and other assistive technologies. If you want some tests, of course tell me. I can test, make other tests, as intermediate.

Thanks a lot for underlining your position with some details. I did't 
know this and hadn't thought about such a hugh impact.

As I wrote the IA2 technology is coming (AFAIK) from IBM. With Rob and 
the other guys we have some employees that can push the integration of 
the IA2 code now better than in the past.

So, I'm very confident that we can see big parts but hopefully the 
complete code in a AOO relase. However, I think you have to wait after 
the 3.4 release.

I hope that we'll have a rough timeline and roadmap for things after the 
3.4 release. Please have a look for it and shout when you see that IA2 
has not the priority that it should have.

I hope the time to wait is not to long for you. ;-)

Marcus


>> It's great to hear from Marcus that dev work is under way. It's up to
>> us in the accessibility community to 'cheer them on'.
>>
>> So please do encourage the NVDA community to join in here. I'll ping
>> the developers and let them know of your interest and this thread that
>> you started.
>
> Ok I'll write to NVDA too.
>
> I stay available,
>
> Best regards,
>
>> Thanks again
>>
>> 1: http://www.linuxfoundation.org/collaborate/workgroups/accessibility/iaccessible2
>>
>> Steve Lee
>> OpenDirective
>>
>> 2011/9/27 Jean-Philippe MENGUAL<mengualjeanphi@free.fr>:
>>> Ok thanks very much for this interesting answer. If you need some
>>> dialogue with NVDA or Orca (Linux), and if I can help as intermediate,
>>> no problem, don't hesitate. I follow the situation as I consider it's a
>>> very important progress to promote better free software in general.
>>>
>>> Thanks for your interest.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Jean-Philippe MENGUAL
>>>
>>>
>>> Le mercredi 28 septembre 2011 � 00:05 +0200, Marcus (OOo) a �crit :
>>>> Am 09/27/2011 08:58 PM, schrieb Jean-Philippe MENGUAL:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Jean-Philippe,
>>>>
>>>>> As ordinary blind user, I work very much to promote OOo and
>>>>> accessibility free software for blind people. The current problem is
>>>>> that public administrations, in France, choose OOo, but blind people are
>>>>
>>>> thanks a lot for your effort to promote OOo. :-)
>>>>
>>>>> complaining, as they consider it's not perfectly accessible with NVDA
>>>>> (Free screen reader for Windows). And migrating to Linux isn't always
>>>>> easy in a network (active directory features, ...).
>>>>>
>>>>> However, IBM Symphony works fine. My problem is that's not a really free
>>>>> software. Nethertheless, IBM, according I was told, gave to the Apache
>>>>> Foundation Iaccessible2, which is the code which enables Symphony to be
>>>>> perfectly accessible with NVDA.
>>>>
>>>> That's correct.
>>>>
>>>>> Could someone study Iaccessible2 and integrate it in OOo? It'd be great
>>>>> if OOo could be accessible with NVDA in the next stable releases. As no
>>>>> developper, I'd appreciate if you could tell me when it's integrated, if
>>>>> someone accepts to do it.
>>>>
>>>> I don't know if it's already completely arrived or if there are still
>>>> some things to fix before it can be integrated into the code. However,
>>>> we are really working on taking advantage of the IA2 technology. Maybe
>>>> Rob can say more about the current status.
>>>>
>>>> It's very unlikely that it will be part of the first AOO release because
>>>> of this and nobody knows the side effects that could occur. So, IMHO
>>>> expect it not for the coming release but for the following one.
>>>>
>>>> HTH
>>>>
>>>> Marcus
>>>
>
> Jean-Philippe MENGUAL