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From Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Fwd: [users] Re: Languages
Date Sat, 03 Sep 2011 22:23:10 GMT
OK.  Before someone starts saying nasty things about Garibaldi, it
would be good to state some things I hope we all agree on:


1) What constitutes a language is as much a political and cultural
question as a linguistic one.  No sense debating it here.

2) OpenOffice.org has a rich history of offering support for many
languages, many more than commercial office suites do.  This is
something we take pride in.  This includes many minority languages,
and even artificial languages like Esperanto.

3) If a group of volunteers wants to enable OpenOffice.org for a new
language, we should point them to information on how to do this.  We
don't need to volunteer to do the translation, or use the translation,
or even agree on the status of the language.  But we should help
someone understand how to do this.  Remember, this might help lead to
a future volunteer for the standard Italian translation as well.

Thanks!

-Rob

On Sat, Sep 3, 2011 at 6:02 PM, Dale Erwin <dale@casaerwin.org> wrote:
> On 9/2/2011 10:23 PM, Pedro F. Giffuni wrote:
>>
>> Hi Dale;
>>
>> With due respect to Italy's cultural richness (which I so
>> much admire being italian myself but not only because of that),
>> Neapolitan is classified as a dialect, not a language, for
>> good reasons.
>>
>> Compared to standard italian you use the same character set
>> and gramatical rules. Furthermore the computer related terms
>> that OpenOffice uses are the same as in standard italian.
>> My recomendation is just to add a dictionary with Naepolitan
>> terms to the standard italian dictionary.
>>
>> best regards,
>>
>> Pedro,
>
> Spoken like a true northern Italian bigot... with all due respect.
>
> Please note I did not call you a northern Italian bigot... I said you speak
> like one.  Maybe you are just misinformed.
>
> I agree that Neapolitan is a dialect because by definition a dialect is a
> LANGUAGE which is not the principal language of the country in which it is
> spoken and it is relegated to a particular region of that country.  But it
> IS a language and is recognized as such by Wikipedia and by the Italian
> Province of Catania and has a rich literary presence spanning several
> centuries.  For a brief time, from 1442 to 1458, Neapolitan was the official
> language of the Kingdom of Naples.  It was supplanted by the Tuscan of Dante
> and Boccaccio which by 1500 had become the accepted literary language of
> Italy and generally referred to as Italian, but there was no official
> language called Italian until the unification of Italy.  Although the
> official date of the unification is 1849, the Kingdom of Naples did not
> become part of the Kingdom of Italy until 1861.  At that time Naples was
> possibly the richest city in the world and it was at this point that 80
> million ducats were removed from the Bank of Naples and moved to the Bank of
> Italy causing the collapse of the entire southern Italian economy.  It also
> gave rise to a bigotry in northern Italy which empowered them to deride the
> southern Italians because of their poverty (which they, the northerners, had
> caused).  For this reason, it became unfashionable to speak Neapolitan.
>  They call it the unification of Italy.  I call it the rape of Naples.
>
> As for having the same character set as Italian, so does French, Spanish,
> Portughese, Rumanian and English.  Are they also dialects?  Of course not.
>
> And Neapolitan has its own grammar, too.  There may be some similarities to
> Italian grammar, just as there are in French, Spanish, Portughese and any
> other Romance language.  Here are but a few Neapolitan Grammar books:
>
> GRAMMATICA DEL DIALETTO NAPOLETANO
>  compilata dal Dottor Raffaele Capozzoli;
>  Luigi Chiurazzi Editore, 1889
>
> 'A LENGUA 'E PULECENELLA - GRAMMATICA NAPOLETANA
>  Carlo Iandolo;
>  Franco di Mauro Editore, 1994
>
> IL NAPOLETANO PARLATO E SCRITTO Con Note di grammatica storica
>  Nicola De Blasi - Luigi Imperatore;
>  Libreria Dante & Descartes, 2000
>
> FACILE FACILE - Impariama la lingua napoletana - Grammatica
>  Colomba Rosaria Andolfi;
>  Kairos Edizioni - Napoli, 2008
>
> MODERN NEAPOLITAN GRAMMAR - GRAMMATICA NAPOLETANA ODIERNA
>  D. Erwin - M. T. Fedele
>  Lulu Press, 2011
>
>
>
> --
> Dale Erwin
> Lurigancho, Lima 15 PERU
>
> http://leather.casaerwin.org
>
>
>
>
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