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From Dave Fisher <dave2w...@comcast.net>
Subject Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Date Tue, 23 Aug 2011 21:09:10 GMT

On Aug 23, 2011, at 1:49 PM, Rob Weir wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 4:04 PM, Marcus (OOo) <marcus.mail@wtnet.de> wrote:
>> I can understand Rob's arguement that we have to split ourself to give
>> support for mailing list(s) and forum in parallel. However, I believe that
>> it would be an advantage when the normal, average user has a choice where to
>> go to get an answer.
>> 
> 
> So let's be clear on what we're proposing.  In order to give the users
> more flexibility, so they don't need to choose between a list or a
> forum, so they can just continue to do exactly what they do today,
> with no change, we will create, moderate and maintain 10 new mailings
> lists, as well as the associated archives:
> 
> ooo-users-en.i.a.o
> ooo-users-es.i.a.o
> ooo-users-hu.i.a.o
> ooo-users-it.i.a.o
> ooo-users-ja.i.a.o
> ooo-users-nl.i.a.o
> ooo-users-pl.i.a.o
> ooo-users-vi.i.a.o
> ooo-users-zh.i.a.o
> 
> Is that that idea?  If so could we get names for 30 moderators,
> please, 3 per forum?  .

It is the idea. Except that each language is added as requested.

How many PPMC moderators? - I think a minimum of one and they are responsible to the rest
of the PPMC for recruiting greater coverage and nominating those with proven merit on the
list for committership. That's my recollection of prior discussion.

On Aug 23, 2011, at 7:55 AM, Kazunari Hirano wrote:

> Hi Marcus and all,
> 
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 11:05 PM, Marcus (OOo) <marcus.mail@wtnet.de> wrote:
>> At the end it seems the best solution is still to go 2 ways: ML and forum.
> +1
> The forum will support 10 languages such as EN(English), ES(Spanish),
> FR(French), HU(Hungarian), IT(Italian), JA(Japanese), NL(Dutch),
> PL(Polish), VI(Vietnamese) and ZH(Chinese).
> The ML should support these languages if those language communities want.
> If we decide that users@openoffice.org subscribers should be invited
> to ooo-users@incubator.apache.org, and discuss@openoffice.org
> subscribers should be invited to ooo-general@incubator.apache.org,
> then Japanese community would like to invite users@ja.openoffice.org
> subscribers to ooo-ja-users@incubator.apache.org, and to invite
> announce@ja.openoffice.org, dev@ja.openoffice.org,
> discuss@ja.openoffice.org, documentation@ja.openoffice.org,
> marketing@ja.openoffice.org, qa@ja.openoffice.org,
> translate@ja.openoffice.org subscribers to
> ooo-ja-general@incubator.apache.org.

These are in a different form from Rob's.

Regards,
Dave


> 
> -Rob
> 
>> Marcus
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Am 08/23/2011 09:50 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
>>> 
>>> +1
>>> 
>>> There is no one-size fits all here.  We should have the list and the
>>> forum. They are not redundant.  Some people will use both.
>>> 
>>>  - Dennis
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Marcus (OOo) [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2011 07:05
>>> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
>>> dev@openoffice.org]
>>> 
>>> Am 08/23/2011 03:29 PM, schrieb Eike Rathke:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi Marcus,
>>>> 
>>>> On Tuesday, 2011-08-23 11:11:35 +0200, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> And very often they write to the list but aren't subscribed. So they
>>>>> don't get the answer unless someone is CC'ing them.
>>>> 
>>>> That actually is a failure of how the list is setup when it has Reply-To
>>>> pointing to the mailing list address (AKA Reply-To mangling). Without
>>>> Reply-To a Reply-All goes to the sender and the mailing list.
>>> 
>>> Maybe, but they are still not subscribed. So the moderator has to let
>>> the posts through; again and again until the user is subscribed.
>>> 
>>>>> In a forum all in one place. You can search, write and can get
>>>>> answers. It's up to us if a subscription is needed. It would work
>>>>> without.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Furthermore, I don't think that mailing lists are common for the
>>>>> average user. But forums are.
>>>> 
>>>> Mailing lists are much more accepted by those who actually help because
>>>> handling is much easier than any web forum. You can setup your own
>>>> scoring, flags, delete unimportant stuff in your personal archive and so
>>>> on. To get the best of both worlds best would be a forum gated to
>>>> a mailing list and vice versa. Searching the mailing list would also be
>>>> possible at mail-archive.com, or gmane..
>>> 
>>> Not before they got to know how this is working. In a forum it is
>>> obvious. All is in one place.
>>> 
>>>>>> What if we just had support forums, but no users list?  Would we
miss
>>>>>> anything?  Would users?  Note that phpBB forums allow a person to
>>>>>> subscribe to a forum or a topic, so those who want to receive emails
>>>>>> can.  But they would need to go back to the forum website to respond.
>>>> 
>>>> And that just sucks.
>>>> 
>>>>> I don't think that we or the users would miss anything because there
>>>>> is no chance to miss something as the communitation method is not
>>>>> existing.
>>>> 
>>>> Well, I try to avoid forums whenever possible.
>>> 
>>> And there are users that try to avoid mailing lists. ;-)
>>> 
>>> At the end it seems the best solution is still to go 2 ways: ML and forum.
>>> 
>>> Marcus
>> 


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