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From Shane Curcuru <>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] <Initial Committer>: Apache Initial Committer Status
Date Sat, 23 Jul 2011 22:11:39 GMT
(<project mentor hat> - note that Ross Gardler has some good comments in 
this thread as well)

On 7/23/2011 1:45 PM, IngridvdM wrote:
> Am 23.07.2011 18:51, schrieb Dave Fisher:
>> On Jul 23, 2011, at 9:29 AM, IngridvdM wrote:
>>> Please find my comments inline.
>>> Am 23.07.2011 14:45, schrieb Marcus (OOo):
> [...]
>>>> And for this we have to define a deadline. My suggestion is still
>>>> end of
>>>> July or latestly end of August.
>>> No given reason has convinced me of the necessity of a deadline here.
>> While there is ample reason to have a generous deadline, I haven't
>> heard a good reason not to have a deadline.
> In general one can avoid a lot of unnecessary work while doing only
> those things where is a good reason to do them.
> In contrast doing all things where is no good reason against leaves one
> with a lot more todos ;-)
> Really this argument is about not becoming too bureaucratic.

The steps to accept the initial committer invitation are fairly simple. 
  They're also fundamentally important to be able to participate in this 
project as a committer.  If someone gets in touch with the PPMC and asks 
for an extension so they can (finish vacation | check with laywer | 
whatever), then I'd suggest being lenient and working with them.  If 
someone hasn't even contacted us back, I have little patience for them, 
nor much expectation that they're truly interested in helping.

> But my other argument is that I feel it is socially alienating if we are
> threatening people with deadlines without giving them a reason for it.
> My impression was that Wolf Halton has felt the same. He has asked for a
> reason, but not gotten an answer yet.

The Apache Way is that the community of active and productive 
committers/PPMC members of this podling run this podling (project). 
Ignoring the simple steps to accept an initial committer invitation says 
to me that the person is not interested in being active or productive 
within this community.

I don't know how to say this as politely as I'd like to be able to say 
it, but this is a crucial point: this list is dedicated to the community 
that is building the Apache OpenOffice podling.  This is a new project 
and community, distinct from - and highly likely to be different from - 
the previous project and community.

To be successful we absolutely need to understand the community methods 
used in the previous project, and consider which of them make sense to 
adopt here.  But we also need to ensure that potential contributors 
understand that this is a separate project, and community norms and 
rules from will not necessarily be carried forward to 
Apache OpenOffice.

> So in the end I think those who are voting for a deadline need to
> provide a good reasons to do so.

Given that August is often for vacations, I'd be happy with the proposed 
deadline of 15-Sept as proposed elsewhere on this thread.  Personally, I 
cannot see the need to extend that deadline any further for initial 
committers unless specific individuals request an extension for some 
concrete reason.

Note that I would also suggest simply calling everyone committers (or 
invited committers), and not emphasize any difference between those in 
the original proposal list and those who are voted on by the PPMC.

- Shane
> Kind regards,
> Ingrid

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