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From Julian Hyde <jh...@apache.org>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Drop requirement that ASF members can join IPMC by just asking
Date Mon, 12 Aug 2019 18:12:12 GMT
I don’t have a strong opinion on the subject of this thread - whether it should be easy for
ASF members to join the IPMC - but I have a strong opinion about a related matter - namely,
how easy it should be for non-ASF members to join the IPMC.

The IPMC should be actively recruiting members of recently-graduated projects to serve as
mentors of the next generation of podlings.

I bet quite a few people people think that you have to be an ASF member to be on the IPMC
or mentor a project. And we certainly give the impression that ASF members make the best mentors.
But I claim that people who have just been through the incubation process also make excellent
mentors. They have experienced the pain, and they know the answers to many of the IT- and
process-related questions because they have just solved them.

Like Sheng, I joined the IPMC before I was a member. The project I founded, Calcite, was close
to graduating and I was active on general@ because being a podling is hard and raises many
questions. Some other podlings were entering incubation and someone (I think Ted Dunning or
Alan Gates) asked me to be a mentor. From that, I was drawn into other Apache projects, saw
the broader Apache community, and was drawn into the worthy task of helping to govern the
Foundation. For me, serving as a mentor was a way of saying ’thank you’ for the help I
had received from mentors during incubation. And for the IPMC, it provided an active and engaged
mentor, always a scarce resource.

Julian
 

> On Aug 8, 2019, at 10:29 PM, Sheng Wu <wu.sheng.841108@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi
> 
> My Apache journey started at Incubator, and as IPMC now(not asf member). I
> noticed this requirement too.
> 
> From the members I known personally, most indeed know Apache way very well.
> And truely there is exception.
> 
> Basically, I think removing this makes sense.
> 
> 1. if this member has been incubator journey, such as being initial
> committer of a podling, it is easy to know and should have taken part in
> incubator ml much.
> 
> 2. there are indeed asf members elected by other reasons, so, they are not
> familiar w/ incubator, and need more time to learn too. Apache has so many
> TLPs and ways to take part in, a member is not required used to be
> incubator.
> 
> My +1 on IPMC should have enough incubator experiences.
> 
> Also, very open to know the history reason of this.
> 
> Sheng
> 
> Justin Mclean <justin@classsoftware.com>于2019年8月9日 周五下午1:04写道:
> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Current any ASF member can come along and ask to join the IPMC. I assume
>> this was put in place for two reasons: ( but don’t know the full history
>> behind it)
>> - There was a lack of mentors.
>> - Is is assumed that if you are an ASF member you know enough about the
>> Apache Way to mentor a project.
>> 
>> I’m not sure if this is the case anymore. And while the mentor situation
>> has improved I don’t think the above has solved the problem of having
>> active members or mentors having the required knowledge and skills they
>> need.
>> 
>> So if you want to be a IPMC member and mentor a project then I think you
>> need you have gone through the full incubation process yourself and/or help
>> out with other incubator duties and get voted in as an IPMC member. Just
>> like every other ASF project.
>> 
>> What do other people think?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Justin
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>> 
>> --
> Sheng Wu
> SkyWalking, Shardingsphere and Zipkin


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