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From Greg Stein <gst...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Slack
Date Tue, 28 Mar 2017 06:18:07 GMT
Phil,

Tools are very different from what the ASF *produces* ... tools are just a
mechanism to assist the community. Choose the right tools, and move on. If
the community likes them, then what does it matter what the license is? I
recognize some people want OSS tools for their entire stack, but the
Foundation has decided to be pragmatic about its tool choices, and to use
donated tools/licenses to stretch our donated dollars further.

If you would like to *run* a chat tool, then go ahead, and invite any/all
communities to use it. Excellent. The Foundation clearly allows its
communities to use external tools, to support those communities. But I will
state that the ASF will not be standing up a chat tool. We have a HipChat
open source community license available, and will provide Rooms for any
project that needs one. And that means we don't have to maintain it.

Cheers,
Greg Stein
Infrastructure Administrator, ASF


On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 11:57 AM, Phillip Rhodes <motley.crue.fan@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I don't understand the desire to use a closed-source, proprietary,
> locked-down walled-garden application like Slack to begin with.   Why
> not use one of the several open-source look-a-like versions that are
> available?  Or use Gitter, which is about to go Open Source[1].
>
> [1]: https://venturebeat.com/2017/03/15/gitlab-acquires-
> software-chat-startup-gitter-will-open-source-the-code/
>
>
> Phil
> This message optimized for indexing by NSA PRISM
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 27, 2017 at 11:32 AM, Wade Chandler <wadechandler@apache.org>
> wrote:
> > The 90 member thing is really odd to me. I think you should write Slack
> help to ask for details about your issue. The agreement does mention
> invites where people don’t accept, and too many of those, could reduce your
> ability to add more members, but this has been really rare in my
> experience, and we have way more for NetBeans, and other than perhaps 10
> people, our over 300+ members were self invited using
> https://netbeans.signup.team/ <https://netbeans.signup.team/> Too, before
> I set all this up, one of the questions I specifically asked Slack was
> related to limitations, members, etc as it was a worry for us, and they
> said there is no real limit on the number of members, but did mention the
> message limits on logging etc, and directed us to setup a log bot while
> taking our request for some other OSS subscription models.
> >
> > Hope it helps,
> >
> > Wade
> >
> >
> >
> >> On Mar 27, 2017, at 01:37, Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb@nanthrax.net>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Yes, but they will be member anyway, so it won't change the limit we
> have today (90), right ?
> >>
> >> Regards
> >> JB
> >>
> >> On 03/27/2017 06:56 AM, Yaniv Rodenski wrote:
> >>> Hi JB,
> >>>
> >>> A common practice/hack is to create a small web app that allows people
> to
> >>> send themselves invitations using the Slack API.
> >>> For example:
> >>> http://www.skill-space.com/blog/2015/11/16/create-an-
> auto-invite-channel-using-slack-heroku1
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> Yaniv
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, 27 Mar 2017 at 3:40 pm, Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb@nanthrax.net>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Hi Wade,
> >>>>
> >>>> You are right: invite people on Slack means adding them as member.
> >>>>
> >>>> However, how can we accept Slack participants without inviting them
?
> Is it
> >>>> possible ?
> >>>>
> >>>> Thanks !
> >>>> Regards
> >>>> JB
> >>>>
> >>>> On 03/26/2017 07:05 PM, Wade Chandler wrote:
> >>>>> My understanding is there isn’t a max limit on Slack for users
for
> free,
> >>>> and I have confirmed this with Slack there is not supposed to be a
> >>>> limitation on numbers of members. NetBeans for instance has 320
> members.
> >>>> Did someone tell you this or did you run into some issue? If so, you
> might
> >>>> write them to ask what is the deal.. It could be the difference in
> setup;
> >>>> we use a registration page which sends invitations
> >>>> https://netbeans.signup.team/ <https://netbeans.signup.team/>
and is
> >>>> using bots from https://stacktodo.com/ <https://stacktodo.com/>
Or,
> it
> >>>> could be something about when it was setup and differences in plans
> over
> >>>> time.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It doesn’t change the limits on the log and file storage, but
we
> explain
> >>>> to folks it is for ephemeral real time communication and never to be
> >>>> considered historic, but we are looking into setting up a log bot
> which
> >>>> Slack personnel told us could also be helpful for OSS use. Slack said
> they
> >>>> don’t have plans for more features for OSS specific projects at the
> moment
> >>>> as one request from us was they make some new individual/personal low
> pay
> >>>> option which could help communities with dedicated membership to pay
> for
> >>>> their own personal use, but they said no plans at this time, but
> would take
> >>>> it into consideration as an idea.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Wade
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On Mar 26, 2017, at 01:58, Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb@nanthrax.net>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Hi,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Slack is very convenient for quick communication, but clearly,
it
> >>>> doesn't change that the mailing list is the first communication
> channel. If
> >>>> discussions happen on Slack, minute notes/discussion has to be
> forwarded on
> >>>> the mailing list.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I wonder if we plan to ask for some "pro" Slack account for
Apache
> >>>> projects (as we have license for IntelliJ for example). Now, at Apache
> >>>> Beam, we reached the max capacity of the Slack free version (90 Slack
> users
> >>>> on Beam channel and limited history). We already received new member
> >>>> request that we can't accept for now.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thoughts ?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Regards
> >>>>>> JB
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On 03/22/2017 10:37 PM, Craig Russell wrote:
> >>>>>>> Hi James,
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> There was a pretty extensive discussion on the netbeans
dev list.
> I’d
> >>>> encourage you to review this thread https://lists.apache.org/
> thread.html/
> >>>> 2dce365d03334c82d31b12c8b3dcad1a925a2f71af75658b8d8a5a07@%
> >>>> 3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> You can get all of the messages in the thread by doing a
quick
> search
> >>>> for “slack” on the dev@netbeans.apache.org list in lists.apache.org.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> My takeaway is that Slack not a substitute for email. But
it is
> useful
> >>>> for ping-pong communication when people are in the heat of
> development.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> But no decisions are made on Slack, and any discussion there
(aside
> >>>> from “add a semicolon there” and “let’s get lunch") needs to
be
> brought
> >>>> back to the dev list.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> The underlying principle is that “if it didn’t happen
on dev, then
> it
> >>>> didn’t happen”. We strive for open, inclusive communications at
> Apache and
> >>>> that means attempting to encourage participation by everyone who
> wants to,
> >>>> regardless of primary language, time zone, and availability of tools.
> (We
> >>>> assume everyone has a device that handles email clients).
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Hope this helps.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Craig
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Mar 22, 2017, at 1:27 PM, James Bognar <jamesbognar@apache.org
> >
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Can someone remind me?  I thought there was a discussion
a couple
> of
> >>>> months
> >>>>>>>> ago about allowing incubator projects to use Slack for
> >>>> communication.  What
> >>>>>>>> was the final decision?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Craig L Russell
> >>>>>>> clr@apache.org
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Jean-Baptiste Onofré
> >>>> jbonofre@apache.org
> >>>> http://blog.nanthrax.net
> >>>> Talend - http://www.talend.com
> >>>>
> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Jean-Baptiste Onofré
> >> jbonofre@apache.org
> >> http://blog.nanthrax.net
> >> Talend - http://www.talend.com
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >
>
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