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From Konstantin Boudnik <...@apache.org>
Subject Re: [DISCUSS] Mentor neutrality policy
Date Fri, 09 Oct 2015 23:38:24 GMT
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 01:29AM, Pierre Smits wrote:
> What are you referring to, Konstantin?

I am referring to the progressives of the world and all "policy frameworks"
they are so readily unleashing on everybody because they have an urge to
meddle. I am very much agree with Chris and Ross on immorality of the
guilt-by-association policy.

Cos

> Best regards,
> 
> Pierre Smits
> 
> *OFBiz Extensions Marketplace*
> http://oem.ofbizci.net/oci-2/
> 
> On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 1:31 AM, Konstantin Boudnik <cos@apache.org> wrote:
> 
> > On Fri, Oct 09, 2015 at 08:36PM, Daniel Gruno wrote:
> > > Does there always have to be an actual problem before we can propose a
> > > policy? must we always be reactive instead of proactive?
> >
> > "We can't just stay on a side and wait, we should do something!" - sounds
> > all
> > too familiar, eh?
> >
> > > Yes, I am in a way implying that some mentors are, perhaps, not neutral
> > > in their work. I will not back it up with specific names or contexts, as
> > > I don't want to take a trip to lawsuit town for things I cannot back up
> > > with publicly available information.
> > >
> > > I don't find this to be uncivil accusations - can you outline a specific
> > > segment that you find uncivil? I am proposing a set of basic rules -
> > > which is naturally up for discussion and improvement - that would
> > > potentially alleviate us from having some nasty discussions - whether
> > > they be public or private - about the neutrality and honesty of
> > > recommendations, and hopefully ensure we have a more leveled playing
> > > field in the incubator.
> > >
> > > I'll stop here, as my eyesight is playing a trick on me today and not
> > > allowing me to see what I type.
> > >
> > > With regards,
> > > Daniel.
> > >
> > > On 10/09/2015 08:03 PM, Chris Douglas wrote:
> > > > What problem does this solve?
> > > >
> > > > This proposal lacks context. It implies that mentors are not neutral,
> > > > and that they are motivated by interests not shared by the ASF. But it
> > > > does not outline the merits of that belief, neither does it specify
> > > > how this proposal would address them. Instead of allowing those
> > > > definitions to float, this discussion would be more productive if it
> > > > were about some concrete problems for which there is evidence. Yet
> > > > another thread of rude responses to uncivil accusations is
> > > > unproductive, even if it is an IPMC tradition. -C
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 8:07 AM, Daniel Gruno <humbedooh@apache.org>
> > wrote:
> > > >> Hi Incubator folks,
> > > >>
> > > >> I would like to propose we adopt a mentor neutrality policy for
> > > >> incubating podlings:
> > > >>
> > > >> - A mentor must not be financially tied to the project or its
> > incubation
> > > >> status.
> > > >> - A mentor must not have a vested interest in incubating, graduating
> > or
> > > >> dismantling a podling that goes beyond the general Apache mission
> > > >> - A mentor must not be affiliated with the entity granting the code
> > > >> (company or original project community)
> > > >>
> > > >> Furthermore, I would like to see this extended to votes on graduating
> > or
> > > >> retiring podlings, so that only people with no organizational (aparty
> > > >> from the ASF) or financial ties to the project (or the companies
> > behind
> > > >> it) can cast a binding vote on graduation or retirement.
> > > >>
> > > >> This would essentially mean:
> > > >>
> > > >> - If you work for a company (or are hired as consultant/advisor) that
> > is
> > > >> entering a project into incubation, you cannot mentor it nor vote
> > > >> for/against its incubation, graduation or retirement.
> > > >> - If you are a in the original community behind the project, you
> > cannot
> > > >> mentor it nor vote for/against it.
> > > >>
> > > >> I believe this would create a neutral mentorship whose sole mission
is
> > > >> to guide podlings with the interests of the ASF in mind.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Please do discuss this. If there is (mostly) positive feedback, I
> > would
> > > >> like to, at some point, have a vote on including this in the Incubator
> > > >> policy. I realize this would cut down on the number of potential
> > > >> mentors, and I would ask that more people step up to the challenge
of
> > > >> mentoring if adopted.
> > > >>
> > > >> With regards,
> > > >> Daniel
> > > >>
> > > >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> > > >>
> > > >
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> > > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
> >
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> >
> >

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