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From Julian Hyde <jh...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Reform of Incubator
Date Tue, 04 Aug 2015 15:56:14 GMT
Cos,

There is no "bureaucratism outbreak". People are not "express[ing]
their expectations as a law-of-the-land". People are trying, in good
faith, to make sure that decisions are made consistent with the Apache
ethos. And before you ask, no, that ethos cannot be written down; it
has to be interpreted via debate. This is what debate sounds like.

Julian


On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 9:03 PM, Konstantin Boudnik <cos@apache.org> wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 03, 2015 at 11:36AM, Roman Shaposhnik wrote:
>> On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 12:37 AM, Bertrand Delacretaz
>> <bdelacretaz@apache.org> wrote:
>> > On Mon, Aug 3, 2015 at 4:05 AM, Roman Shaposhnik <roman@shaposhnik.org>
wrote:
>> >> ...who else thinks the movement towards empowering
>> >> PPMCs and making IPMC very much like the board makes sense?...
>> >
>> > How is that different from the status quo where a podling with active
>> > mentors can have their releases +1ed by their mentors, requiring
>> > minimal interaction with the IPMC?
>>
>> I think it is more of a bias issue. IOW, today it seems that the default bias
>> of IPMC is to consider itself a final authority (or a gatekeeper) on podling
>> releases. We need to break that bias and make it so that it is truly a safety
>> net, rather than a gatekeeper.
>>
>> IOW, I'd like the release traffic on general@ to ONLY consist of [NOTICE]
>> emails, not [VOTE].
>
> We perhaps are observing the well known phenomena called self-selection bias
> [1] And it seems to me that the simplification and better clarification of the
> incubation guidelines might be exactly what's needed to prevent a
> bureaucratism outbreak. As well as the situation when ppl express their
> expectations as a law-of-the-land (even from best intentions).
>
> Cos
>

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