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From Rob Vesse <rve...@dotnetrdf.org>
Subject Re: Incubating with Apache Commons as champion?
Date Tue, 20 Jan 2015 15:08:31 GMT
Stian

If a community made predominantly of existing Apache committers (or
containing a strong core of) already exists and this would be a small self
contained module as part of Apache Commons then why does the Incubator
need be involved at all?

Why can this not just be submitted directly to Apache Commons via the IP
Clearance procedure (http://incubator.apache.org/ip-clearance/index.html)?
 

Commons already allows any ASF committer to commit so the existing
community can continue working on the code just fine.  The only sticking
point would be once Commons-RDF wants to release in which case you'd
likely need to canvas the larger commons community for votes until such
time as the Commons-RDF committers have earned sufficient merit to be
offered PMC membership

On the other hand does Commons-RDF necessarily need to come to the ASF at
all?  If it is a small self-contained interface module that will remain
stable what does it gain (other than brand association) by coming to the
ASF?

Rob

On 20/01/2015 14:28, "Stian Soiland-Reyes" <stain@apache.org> wrote:

>The discussion on dev@commons about coming-to-Apache Commons-RDF
>(https://github.com/commons-rdf/commons-rdf/) seems to be rejecting a
>temporary mailing list like rdf@commons as it is seen t be splitting
>Apache Commons as a project - the ideal committer on Apache Commons is
>caring about all its components (avoiding the Jakarta pitfalls).
>
>
>We had not considered becoming a TLP as once the API (mainly a set of
>interfaces) is settled, by then it will probably be pretty much a
>quiet project except the odd maintenance patch - and also by being a
>common component of several RDF projects within Apache, its best home
>then would be under Commons (presumably with most of the original
>committers still involved).
>
>
>However the large traffic of dev@commons (~400/month) about all the
>other components can be a problem for trying to engage the non-Apache
>community around commons-rdf while we flesh out the API. (This has
>currently been done solely through Github issues, pull requests, and
>"watching" the project).
>
>In a way we are limited by the technology of the Apache mailing lists.
>(I know, I know...).
>
>(I mentioned gitlab.com )
>
>
>The suggestion is that Commons-RDF could be a incubator project, but
>with a projected path to become part of the Apache Commons instead of
>a TLP.  (I believe this path has not happened before)
>
>
>So this would be using the old structure of having a champion of
>Apache Commons - could this be a workable incubator project?
>
>In a way it would be incubating just the code until API maturity
>rather than the community or "Apache Way" as both of those already
>exist.
>
>In such an (old skool) setup, would it be the Commons PMC /
>dev@commons who would vote over the incubating releases?
>
>Once "graduating" it would just become a component under Apache
>Commons and the community would just be dev@commons where the
>committers would already be members - the dev@rdf.incubator list would
>simply close.
>
>.. and where would mentors come from? Would existing committers from
>those other Apache projects (Jena, Marmotta, Clerezza) be enough - or
>should it be someone from IMPC or from dev@commons?
>
>
>See 
>http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/commons-dev/201501.mbox/%3CCAB917
>RLJE%2BgFEpw%3Dyp-c-HpXEnvL12JZLLpc4wphGyjGH_6%3D9Q%40mail.gmail.com%3E
>for the whole threads :)
>
>
>---------- Forwarded message ----------
>From: Stian Soiland-Reyes <stain@apache.org>
>Date: 20 January 2015 at 14:06
>Subject: Re: [DISCUSS][RDF] Separate mailing list for Commons RDF
>To: Commons Developers List <dev@commons.apache.org>
>
>
>Agree that maybe the the Incubator with a projected path to the
>Commons could be a workable middle ground while Commons-RDF is still
>"incubating" code-wise (but not community or Apache Way-wise).
>
>No earlier project has gone through this route
>(https://incubator.apache.org/projects/ ) - this would reuse the
>deprecated "Champion" project to be Apache Commons instead of
>Incubator PMC in this case.
>
>Such a proposal has some good features - I presume commons-rdf
>releases would still be voted over (and thus involve) the Commons PMC
>and dev@commons  (as they would after "graduating").
>
>As an API, then Commons-RDF should not be considered stable while
>being in 0.x.x-incubating anyway.
>
>
>
>On 20 January 2015 at 13:58, Torsten Curdt <tcurdt@vafer.org> wrote:
>>>  There are several ASF projects in the
>>> RDF space.  They have been through the incubator.  Please do talk to
>>>those
>>> projects if you have concerns.
>>
>> I am sorry - but how are those projects relevant in this case?
>>
>> And what's so bad about the incubator? You could (maybe) later on come
>> to Commons.
>>
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>
>--
>Stian Soiland-Reyes
>Apache Taverna (incubating)
>http://orcid.org/0000-0001-9842-9718
>
>-- 
>Stian Soiland-Reyes
>Apache Taverna (incubating)
>http://orcid.org/0000-0001-9842-9718
>
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