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From "Ross Gardler (MS OPEN TECH)" <Ross.Gard...@microsoft.com>
Subject RE: Proposals - wiki required?
Date Sun, 23 Nov 2014 19:21:29 GMT
I'd like it to remain pink please.

(look up bikeshedding on Wikipedia if this makes no sense)

Trying to be more constrictive...

Proposal docs are useful. The wiki is a convenient place to find them after the fact (something
I find necessary at least once a month for at least one podling). Whatever the docs say about
SHOULD or MUST, the fact is we put the proposal in the wiki by tradition for good reasons.

Unless tradition is causing a problem there is no problem.

Do we want to codify tradition? Most of our policies are flexible where they need to be (which
is almost everywhere), its part of the strength of the foundation. In this case a proposal
not being in the wiki would cause no irreversible harm (a minor inconvenience, yes, harm no)

Is it really worth a long debate on general@?

In conclusion, I don't care, as long as it remains the traditional pink, I happen to like
it that way.

Sent from my Windows Phone
________________________________
From: jan i<mailto:jani@apache.org>
Sent: ‎11/‎23/‎2014 11:00 AM
To: general@incubator.apache.org<mailto:general@incubator.apache.org>
Subject: Re: Proposals - wiki required?

On 23 November 2014 at 19:41, Alan Cabrera <list@toolazydogs.com> wrote:

>
> > On Nov 23, 2014, at 8:40 AM, jan i <jani@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > I dont want to criminalize anybody, but on the other hand I would like to
> > have 1 common place where to look for accepted proposals.
> >
> > Having the proposals, at least after acceptance, in one place should be
> > beneficial to everyone, so how about wording it as a strong suggestion.
>
> Let's look at how the proposal process works. It starts with a proposal
> email.  We don't troll a particular web space looking for new proposals.
> Dictating that the proposals start in one place needlessly adds rules that
> don't solve any problems.
>
> As for storing them in one place after acceptance, why?
>
SImple so that new "recruits" can go and get ideas of how to interpret the
different headlines. The headlines might be simple to you, but I had to
look at some proposals to understand some of the headlines.

I am champion for 2 projects (one seems to go in another direction) and
found it very useful to point the projects at the wiki. It saved my quite a
lot of explanations (and discussions). I have found that projects who want
to join, dont really understand how/why a proposal is needed, giving
examples of successful projects makes that part a lot easier.


>
> Adding strongly worded "should"s dilutes guidelines and adds to the
> reading homework of new podlings that will already have the good sense to
> use a wiki, or something better that us old folk haven't thought of.
>

Like you I am against "rules", and I don't care whether its wiki or foo, I
simply like to know where I can find "real life" proposals. My idea of
using "should" instead of "rule" was to signal, that it must be stored
somewhere, preferable (for now) in wiki.

Seen with my iPMC hat on, it is a bit of history that we should not throw
away, I used it a couple of times on a couple of projects to see how they
have evolved.

But of course it is just my opinion, and if everybody else think
differently, then I will not be the one who are difficult.

rgds
jan i.


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