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From sebb <seb...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: Bloated NOTICE files are evil
Date Mon, 13 Oct 2014 17:14:01 GMT
On 12 October 2014 17:40, Roman Shaposhnik <rvs@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 5:16 AM, sebb <sebbaz@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I don't think that's correct.
>
> Well, since neither of us is a lawyer (at least I am not) at this
> point we're debating interpretations on ALv2.
>
>> A source distribution with NOTICE may be included in an ASF binary
>> distribution - e.g. example code is often included in biary dists.
>> In this case the relevant parts of the source NOTICE would need to be
>> considered for inclusion in the ASF NOTICE for the binary.
>>
>> In other words a source distribution affects all works that include
>> it, not just source distributiions.
>
> My opinion is that you're abusing the notion of the distribution here.

I meant distribution in the sense of being publically available for
distribution, rather than the word as used by Linux providers.

I think my usage agrees with the "Apache License and Distribution FAQ"

http://www.apache.org/foundation/license-faq.html

>> The NOTICE file in an ASF source release must contain all *required*
>> attributions for all included bits, and must not contain attributions
>> for bits that are not included. Only INCLUDED bits affect the NOTICE
>> (and LICENSE) files.
>
> Correct.

I'm glad we agree on something.

Do you agree that the above paragraph also applies to ASF binary releases?

>> The process for determining what goes in the ASF NOTICE file starts
>> with the contents of the associated release artifact.
>
> I still maintain that my interpretation of ALv2 makes it relevant
> what distribution we're talking about source or binary.

That is the first time I have encountered the notion.
Which parts of the ALv2 lead you to that conclusion?

>>>    3. presence or absence of NOTICEs in binary distribution doesn't
>>>        affect source distribution.
>>
>> Not true.
>
> That would be your opinion at this point. The one that I don't share.
>
>>>    4. presence or absence of NOTICEs in source distribution doesn't
>>>        affect binary distribution.
>>
>> Not true.
>
> Ditto.

If you are saying that the NOTICE in an ASF binary release has no
direct bearing on the NOTICE in the corresponding ASF source release,
then strictly speaking I agree with you (though of course both will
have the same pre-amble, and may indeed be identical). The NOTICE in
an ASF source release does however affect the corresponding ASF binary
release.

However, if you are saying that a NOTICE in an arbitrary _binary_
distribution does not affect an ASF _source_ distribution which
includes said _binary_ distribution,  then I don't agree. Likewise if
you swap _binary_ and _source_ in the previous sentence.

> Thanks,
> Roman.
>
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