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From Dave Brondsema <>
Subject Re: [VOTE] Graduation of Apache Allura from the Incubator
Date Sun, 16 Mar 2014 03:43:44 GMT
On 3/14/14 8:19 PM, sebb wrote:
> On 14 March 2014 20:16, Cory Johns <> wrote:
>> Ok, I think we've addressed all of the issues.  Namely:
>> * The status page (
>> has been updated, and now the correct canonical project web page (namely
>>, as well as having an improved
>> project description, links to the docs, and updated news items
>> * The aforementioned docs are now hosted at
>> (which is also linked to from the
>> main project page at
>> * The footer on has been fixed
>> with the correct trademark and copyright information and links
>> * All Apache Allura (incubating) references have been corrected on
>>, and
>> Additionally, the unused page at has
>> been updated to automatically redirect to the main project page at
>>, and its associated (unused)
>> download page has been updated with a link to the releases repository, so
>> that they are useful for people who may have bookmarked them previously,
>> even though they are no longer linked to from anywhere.
>> This should cover all of the concerns that have been raised thus far, save
>> for the location of the issue tracker which, as previously mentioned, is a
>> difficult undertaking that will be addressed in the future (and the status
>> page indicates this).
> Well, there is still the issue of the download page.
> There does not seem to be any way to find it from the new site.

There's a download button in the middle of the page.

> Also there are some branding requirements that are missing from the site.
> See
> In particular

I've added these links to our main navigation page.  I've also added the ™ as

Thanks for your feedback on all this.  Is there anything else we're missing for

>> With these changes, we are hopeful that we can proceed with and pass the
>> graduation vote.
>> On Fri, Mar 14, 2014 at 8:18 AM, sebb <> wrote:
>>> If the home page really is
>>> [1]
>>> then why does the status page
>>> [2]
>>> point to
>>> [3] ?
>>> The host [1] is described on the status page [2] as being the Wiki,
>>> which is normally separate from the project page.
>>> There seems to be very little on [3] that is not on [1] so it could
>>> probably be dropped.
>>> However the Wiki [1] does not have the correct footer, it only says:
>>> "This project is powered by Allura."
>>> That should be Apache Allura.
>>> And the pages also need the standard trademark attributions.
>>> The site [3] does have the following:
>>> Copyright © 2011 The Apache Software Foundation, Licensed under the
>>> Apache License, Version 2.0.
>>> Apache and the Apache feather logo are trademarks of The Apache
>>> Software Foundation.
>>> <<
>>> However that fails to mention Apache Allura and Allura as being
>>> trademarks of the ASF.
>>> On 14 March 2014 04:32, Dave Brondsema <> wrote:
>>>> On 03/13/2014 10:00 PM, David Nalley wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 9:54 PM, David Nalley <> wrote:
>>>>>> On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 1:29 PM, Roman Shaposhnik <>
>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> After looking at it for some time, my optimistic outlook
>>>>>>> on the project would be +0 vote at best.
>>>>>>> On the plus side, the community seems to be really active
>>>>>>> and reasonably diverse. But if feels, like ASF has not yet
>>>>>>> become a true home for the project.
>>>>>>> Here's what I'm talking about: as a casual bystander who
>>>>>>> was trying to view Allura as an ASF project -- I had difficult
>>>>>>> time. First of all, I couldn't even get to the releases easily
>>>>>>> enough:
>>>>>>> When I managed to get there the first thing that the README
>>>>>>> instructed me to do is to go to
>>>>>>> What is that? How does it relate to the project?
>>>>>>> In fact, from the dev list it feels like there may be yet another
>>>>>>> canonical place for the Allura -- over at sourceforge:
>>>>>>> I am not quite sure if penalizing the project with a failed graduation
>>>>>>> vote is the right thing to do, but the state of the outwards
>>>>>>> project assets doesn't inspire a feel of a strong ASF community
in me
>>>>>>> Just my 2c worth of feedback.
>>>>>> The projects bug tracker also seems to be at, which
>>>>>> means you need a account to participate in the project. Based
>>>>>> on a quick perusal most of the dev@ traffic seems to be bug tracker
>>>>>> which means most of this is happening at SourceForge. I don't know
>>>>>> that this is really problematic - we do have projects using github
>>>>>> the main portion of the contribution workflow, but it does give me
>>>>>> pause.
>>>>>> I also see - which bears a SF logo, and which
>>>>>> doesn't note the fact that the project is at the incubator until
>>>>>> down the page. And nowhere on the page is it referred to as Apache
>>>>>> Allura. From a standpoint of the project which is supposed to be
>>>>>> policing its brand, this leaves me a bit worried - this page shows
>>>>>> update to that page recently; and appears at least to the outside
>>>>>> world to be the nexus for the project and maintained by members of
>>>>>> PPMC.  (first return on Google is the sourceforge link.) To be clear
>>>>>> other projects have listings at Sourceforge, so aside from the brand
>>>>>> and trademark policing that needs to happen, I am not sure the
>>>>>> existence of the page is much to be concerned about.
>>>>>> There's a notice on the page that reads: "Some project information
>>>>>> still at SourceForge during this transition period." and indeed,
>>>>>> there's which looks surprisingly
>>>>>> good when compared with which
>>>>>> doesn't have a working bug tracker link, and steps listed for building
>>>>>> Allura consists of 'TODO'. All of the content from the allure source
>>>>>> forge site appears to be in the Apache Allura git repo, so I am
>>>>>> curious why it isn't published at the ASF. And again, we have projects
>>>>>> who host documentation at ReadTheDocs, so I am not sure that
>>>>>> documentation living elsewhere is an inherent problem, but it gives
>>>>>> pause.
>>>>>> Individually I don't know that any of these are problematic; but
I am
>>>>>> curious what the mentors take on it is.
>>>>>> --David
>>>>> And it's just dawned on me what's happening.
>>>>> The project is using as it's
>>>>> home page instead of which appears
>>>>> to have all of the appropriate content (according to a google cache)
>>>>> but is down right now. It's making more sense; is the intention to
>>>>> make that the project home page? (e.g.
>>>> You got it!  (And bad timing that it was down for several hours today -
>>>> its back up now).
>>>> Roman and sebb had similar comments to yours, so I'll respond in a
>>>> single email.
>>>> We are self-hosting at so that
>>>> is really our "home page".  It has a clear download link, and git browse
>>>> link, and the text doesn't equate the project == the software.  But it
>>>> is missing a link to  (Note
>>>> this domain forge-allura.a.o also has the future potential to be a
>>>> project hosting platform for other interested Apache projects besides
>>>> Allura itself)
>>>> is not maintained as is obvious.
>>>> That should just go away or be redirected to
>>>>  Similarly when we're a TLP,
>>>> can just redirect there.
>>>> We should update to remove the SF logo, and
>>>> clearly identify it as Apache Allura and incubating, so it adheres with
>>>> Apache branding guidelines.
>>>> The docs at could be moved to live
>>>> at a URL like with a little
>>>> work.  No reason not to.
>>>> Tickets are the other item still on SourceForge.  We do want to move
>>>> them over to the forge-allura.a.o host, but to be frank its going to be
>>>> quite a lot of work and we haven't gotten to it.  The SourceForge ticket
>>>> tracker is configured to send ticket activity to the allura-dev list so
>>>> there is visibility and transparency to ticket activity.  We didn't
>>>> think it'd be a graduation blocker to have tickets on a different host.
>>>>  As has been mentioned, other projects have tickets elsewhere too.
>>>> I hope this helps clarify the situation.  We will work on polishing up
>>>> the remaining rough edges (perhaps everything except tickets location)
>>>> in the next few days and then provide an update again on this thread.
>>>> Thanks
>>>> --
>>>> Dave Brondsema :
>>>> : personal
>>>> : programming
>>>>                <><
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