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Subject: Re: No more existing-TLP graduations (was: [PROPOSAL] Curator for the
 Apache Incubator)
From: Daniel Kulp <dkulp@apache.org>
In-Reply-To: <CD529E98.B8CBA%chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2013 17:36:42 -0800
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Message-Id: <60F7DA9E-8507-4577-8182-EB42D88095E5@apache.org>
References: <CD529E98.B8CBA%chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
To: general@incubator.apache.org


On Feb 26, 2013, at 5:21 PM, "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" =
<chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov> wrote:

> Hi Dave,
>=20
> On 2/26/13 4:18 PM, "Dave Fisher" <dave2wave@comcast.net> wrote:
>=20
>>>=20
>>> This is exactly the scenario I have in mind. Most of the times,
>>> projects aim for being very successful and have their own healthy
>>> community, but that is not always the outcome, and exiting Incubator
>>> as an adopted project should be still be a possibility.
>>=20
>> I don't think we should exclude incubating projects from being
>> incorporated into other projects. It may be preferred to the attic or
>> github should a community fail to thrive. The incubator does not need =
to
>> be TLP or fail.
>>=20
>> Perhaps the assimilation of an incubating podling to another PMC =
should
>> not be called graduation. Maybe it should be handled piece by piece.
>>=20
>> (1) PPMC votes to approach a PMC with Mentor / IPMC approval like for =
a
>> release.
>=20
> Please name me a specific example scenario in which #1 has happened at =
the
> ASF without pre stated intent to join that TLP.

I'm going to date myself an make myself feel old, but:   Yoko

Originally, Yoko was planning to be a TLP.  However, the entire CORBA =
space kind of died and the original company involved with donating the =
code more or less withdrew support.  However, by then Geronimo had taken =
it as an important dependency and a few of the Geronimo folks had =
started contributing fixes and stuff to it.    Some CXF users were using =
the web service parts of it.    However, the community itself really =
couldn't get enough traction.  (partially because it was a split =
community between the ORB folks and the WS folks).  Thus, instead of =
graduating to TLP, it kind of split with the ORB going to Geromino and =
the WS bits being assimilated into CXF's main build. =20

So, it the community didn't completely die.  Incubation wasn't really a =
failure.   The incubation efforts really showed that it should have been =
parts of the existing TLPs.

Dan


> I would be very surprised to see it happen b/c it would imply =
graduation
> into an existing TLP wasn't premeditated.
> That's the whole point of the "sponsoring PMC" portion of the =
Incubator
> proposal, from the beginning, to declare
> the intent to graduate into a existing TLP - otherwise that section
> wouldn't be needed and the answer would always
> be Incubator PMC. For the record, since the whole umbrella project =
thing,
> most of the sponsoring (I can name perhaps 1-5)
> incoming Incubator podlings are all Incubator PMC sponsored, for =
intent to
> graduate to TLP.
>=20
> On the graduating into existing TLP end, I don't think that makes =
sense -
> apparently at least 2 other people don't either judging by +1s and =
words.
> I would like to fix that. But, I don't think I've ever seen #1 where =
they
> haven't already declared that their intent from the beginning.
>=20
>>=20
>> (2) Receiving PMC votes to accept IP - if not cleared then it accepts
>> that responsibility.
>=20
> If PMCs can accept the type of "podling sized" IP contribution then I
> think that the Incubator is a pointless committee.
>=20
> Cheers,
> Chris
>=20
>=20
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>=20

--=20
Daniel Kulp
dkulp@apache.org - http://dankulp.com/blog
Talend Community Coder - http://coders.talend.com


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