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Subject: Re: No more existing-TLP graduations (was: [PROPOSAL] Curator for the
 Apache Incubator)
From: Dave Fisher <dave2wave@comcast.net>
In-Reply-To: <CD529E98.B8CBA%chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2013 09:44:27 -0800
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References: <CD529E98.B8CBA%chris.a.mattmann@jpl.nasa.gov>
To: general@incubator.apache.org


On Feb 26, 2013, at 5:21 PM, Mattmann, Chris A (388J) wrote:

> Hi Dave,
>=20
> On 2/26/13 4:18 PM, "Dave Fisher" <dave2wave@comcast.net> wrote:
>=20
>>>=20
>>> This is exactly the scenario I have in mind. Most of the times,
>>> projects aim for being very successful and have their own healthy
>>> community, but that is not always the outcome, and exiting Incubator
>>> as an adopted project should be still be a possibility.
>>=20
>> I don't think we should exclude incubating projects from being
>> incorporated into other projects. It may be preferred to the attic or
>> github should a community fail to thrive. The incubator does not need =
to
>> be TLP or fail.
>>=20
>> Perhaps the assimilation of an incubating podling to another PMC =
should
>> not be called graduation. Maybe it should be handled piece by piece.
>>=20
>> (1) PPMC votes to approach a PMC with Mentor / IPMC approval like for =
a
>> release.
>=20
> Please name me a specific example scenario in which #1 has happened at =
the
> ASF without pre stated intent to join that TLP.

I'll give you a possible - If ODFToolkit fails to have a large enough =
community then two possible TLPs might be willing to assimilate the =
community - either OpenOffice or POI.

It was specifically intended not to be part of OpenOffice, and two of =
the podling mentors are POI PMC members.

> I would be very surprised to see it happen b/c it would imply =
graduation
> into an existing TLP wasn't premeditated.

Premeditated by the whole of the Initial Committers? No. A thought by =
one or two people as a "Plan B"? Yes. A prod to the podling, yes.

Each case differs. I can agree that we do not want to encourage new =
podlings to come in with Plan A to be graduating into an existing TLP, =
but I don't think we should exclude a future case should it be strong =
enough to convince the IPMC.

Put another way, we should not decide all policy based only on the =
latest worst case - Hive/HCatalog.

Regards,
Dave

> That's the whole point of the "sponsoring PMC" portion of the =
Incubator
> proposal, from the beginning, to declare
> the intent to graduate into a existing TLP - otherwise that section
> wouldn't be needed and the answer would always
> be Incubator PMC. For the record, since the whole umbrella project =
thing,
> most of the sponsoring (I can name perhaps 1-5)
> incoming Incubator podlings are all Incubator PMC sponsored, for =
intent to
> graduate to TLP.
>=20
> On the graduating into existing TLP end, I don't think that makes =
sense -
> apparently at least 2 other people don't either judging by +1s and =
words.
> I would like to fix that. But, I don't think I've ever seen #1 where =
they
> haven't already declared that their intent from the beginning.
>=20
>>=20
>> (2) Receiving PMC votes to accept IP - if not cleared then it accepts
>> that responsibility.
>=20
> If PMCs can accept the type of "podling sized" IP contribution then I
> think that the Incubator is a pointless committee.
>=20
> Cheers,
> Chris
>=20
>=20
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>=20


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