From general-return-38957-apmail-incubator-general-archive=incubator.apache.org@incubator.apache.org Tue Dec 18 01:38:42 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by minotaur.apache.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 94B23DBB4 for ; Tue, 18 Dec 2012 01:38:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 35996 invoked by uid 500); 18 Dec 2012 01:38:41 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 35716 invoked by uid 500); 18 Dec 2012 01:38:41 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list general@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 35707 invoked by uid 99); 18 Dec 2012 01:38:41 -0000 Received: from nike.apache.org (HELO nike.apache.org) (192.87.106.230) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 18 Dec 2012 01:38:41 +0000 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.7 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (nike.apache.org: domain of bimargulies@gmail.com designates 209.85.214.45 as permitted sender) Received: from [209.85.214.45] (HELO mail-bk0-f45.google.com) (209.85.214.45) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Tue, 18 Dec 2012 01:38:33 +0000 Received: by mail-bk0-f45.google.com with SMTP id jk13so19025bkc.18 for ; Mon, 17 Dec 2012 17:38:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=Y4W892Aaa0N6QVYPVLLe+it7T2LczOxQrjUWTghxE9c=; b=L46PBC5wPwJThQykWq30J+EZMf77E+BaCFlXZGI9JAFdnJdvp0NcQvucawHsoaY8i+ IFC9UPA5mm30tBSkeZIpp1rVMWgOIS713Dh1tAbz0Ieh8xZwvf2iGsSDdY8paoy7M/Lc IWAveVJj+Vw+wHMNK51I4MsXpdu8MOvhtFjk2lQOnEAo+VuYpfjRQSm+tiJS+Es/E9eE cLL9d3Q8qiBd43sFrOH1o5DT2f8EwRjLftuB1Rb5URUYS3e5GB6G09fg+hI3L5xbbax6 JvyCDVZsTDeUrNQZkhsvwRVYoh5YDHdun5WENI2w13YnGlMLgQjFOFPPhCDXql1tLyus bUaA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.204.147.143 with SMTP id l15mr110285bkv.28.1355794693326; Mon, 17 Dec 2012 17:38:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.205.78.134 with HTTP; Mon, 17 Dec 2012 17:38:13 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 20:38:13 -0500 Message-ID: Subject: Re: More and better report nagging From: Benson Margulies To: "general@incubator.apache.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 8:23 PM, Tim Williams wrote: > On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 7:48 PM, Benson Margulies wrote: >> On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 7:35 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote: >>> On Mon, Dec 17, 2012 at 4:04 PM, Tim Williams wrote: >>>> FWIW, I feel the same. I'd rather see 'did not report' and let the >>>> IPMC look for that pattern. Maybe just have your template generator >>>> default to DNR in the text? >>> >>> +1 on defaulting to DNR. >>> >>> How about sending out the whole Incubator report to all podling dev lists, >>> every month? That way the DNR shows up without an IPMC member having to >>> notice and take action. But in addition, it increases podling exposure to >>> other projects and to the ASF at large. >>> >>> An alternative is to send it out to only the podlings that are reporting for a >>> cycle, but that's more work and doesn't serve the purpose of connecting the >>> podling to being in the Incubator quite so cleanly. >> >> >> I feel all that we are all volunteers, that podlings are volunteers >> who don't necessarily have their organizational act together, and that >> calling them out for DNR is not a very effective technique to >> providing the supervision that we, as a PMC, are on the hook for. So >> I'm inclined for now to nag, and to spend a few minutes making that >> job less labor-intensive. > > I'm beginning to think your mind's made up and the original question > was a pleasantry, but in case not... At this point I'm cogitating. > > I hold a different view of things. While I think that we, ok you, are > on the hook for a board report, we've (PMC) delegated[1] the reporting > of each podling to the mentors that we approved for that podling. We > aren't "calling out the podling" as DNR - we're calling out their > mentor as DNR. If there's additional nags to go out, I'd do my > "default to DNR" and send the nag to the mentors directly. > > Ultimately, making that job less labor-intensive involves getting > mentors and would-be-mentors to realize they can't simply go around > spewing their seeds as absentee fathers - it's a real commitment; to > the podling and to the foundation. Shucks, keeping a record of > deadbeat mentors would prolly help... > > In the end though, you've a thankless and tough job, so consider these > as constructive thoughts to be readily ignored in favor of whatever it > takes to get your job done:) > > Thanks, > --tim > > [1] - http://incubator.apache.org/incubation/Roles_and_Responsibilities.html#Mentor > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org