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From Eric Yang <eric...@gmail.com>
Subject Re: How to grow podling communities
Date Wed, 28 Nov 2012 06:56:32 GMT
Thank you, Sally.  This information is very helpful.

regards,
Eric

On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 1:50 PM, Sally Khudairi <sk@apache.org> wrote:

> Thanks, Suresh. Hello Eric, Ross, and IPMC members.
>
> We --ASF Marketing & Publicity-- are happy to work with any (P)PMC on a
> project's publicity once the project has graduated from the Incubator.
>
> We can issue a press release to announce the graduation --similar to [1],
> [2], and [3]. Once you're a TLP, we can also help announce major project
> milestones in a press release [4] or media alert [5] and [6], as well as
> advise on technical fact sheets [7] or "The ASF Asks: Have You Met Apache
> [Projectname]?" -type of "birth announcements" [8] that provide further
> technical details.
>
>
> All official ASF announcements are published on an international news wire
> service, and also posted on the ASF Foundation Blog and @TheASF Twitter
> feed.
>
>
> Whilst projects are prohibited from issuing any formal announcements (over
> a newswire) whilst undergoing incubation, we strongly encourage your
> contributors to blog about the project, as well as publish updates on
> mailing lists, speak at conferences, hold meetups/barcamps/user groups, and
> engage the community in other ways to build interest.
>
> You are more than welcome to request blogging credentials from the ASF
> Infrastructure team to post to https://blogs.apache.org/ --I recommend
> you consider asking that they establish a project-specific sub-directory
> (such as http://blogs.apache.org/OOo/ ) so you have a dedicated space for
> your project.
>
> I also recommend you establish your own Twitter feed for the project and
> use the @TheASF, #Apache, and #OpenSource tags (among others) where
> appropriate --lots of folks follow these and help spread the word.
>
> As for mailing lists, we have lots of technical journalists follow the
> announce@apache.org list as well as the public Incubator archives (at
> times I receive media queries about projects I wasn't even aware were
> submitted for incubation!)
>
> And I strongly suggest that we lean on friends, employers, users, and
> partners to help spread the word. There's a company that issues a press
> announcement (mostly blogs) with every single release made in the project
> that their products heavily rely on, with formal press releases issued as
> "attaboys" to reinforce the ASF news. That project gains lots of visibility
> through someone else's resources. Similar instances exist with outreach
> events, such as workshops, trainings, and BoFs at conferences.
>
> I *always* push for testimonials, use cases, and highly-visible
> implementations, both in our press releases [9], [10] as well as project
> Websites [11] --as you can imagine, not only does this give members of the
> press/analyst community the answer to "who uses you?", it also proves to
> other possible users that the project is viable, credible, and reliable.
>
> I hope this helps. Feel free to ping me or the team at press@apache.orgif you need anything!
>
> -Sally
>
> [1]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces33
> [2]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces24
> [3]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces23
> [4]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces29
> [5]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces31
> [6]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/media_alert_the_apache_software2
> [7] https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/apache_wicket_v6_0_0
> [8] https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_asf_asks_have_you1
> [9]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces26
> [10]
> https://blogs.apache.org/foundation/entry/the_apache_software_foundation_announces21
> [11] http://wiki.apache.org/hadoop/PoweredBy
>
>
>
> >________________________________
> > From: Suresh Marru <smarru@apache.org>
> >To: general@incubator.apache.org
> >Cc: ASF Marketing & Publicity <press@apache.org>
> >Sent: Tuesday, 27 November 2012, 11:01
> >Subject: Re: How to grow podling communities
> >
> >Apologies for the cross post, but I am including press since Eric has
> some constructive observations here.
> >
> >On Nov 27, 2012, at 1:44 AM, Eric Johnson <eric@tibco.com> wrote:
> >
> >> I'm mostly just a lurker on this list, having thought about bringing a
> project to Apache about 24 months ago[1], realizing we didn't quite have
> the demand/community. Since then I've been lurking, wanting to see
> when/whether it makes sense to attempt it again, reflecting on the state of
> the project I'm working on.
> >>
> >> From where I'm sitting, I think the incubator actually should do much
> more here. Big picture - bunch of developers with some cool code come to
> possible the foremost organization for open source projects. They start
> incubating, and discover that part of their incubation process is to market
> themselves to grow their community, and yet not much help arrives to do
> that. On top of that, (a) the developers likely have weak marketing skills,
> (b) don't have a budget for marketing & travel, (c) aren't given any tips
> from others more experienced about what kinds of resources they should
> scare up and which efforts they should focus on first.
> >>
> >> I see the incubator process ought to play three roles:
> >>
> >> a) teaching the Apache rules/community/approach
> >>
> >> b) teaching optimal open source project hygiene (which includes items
> listed below, such as quick turn-around on patch reviews, decent website,
> tutorials, public mailing list discussion) - and actually include "grading"
> on the quality of those items before graduation.
> >>
> >> c) assistance and reporting on "marketing". What the heck does this
> mean?
> >>
> >> I think the incubator currently has parts (a) & (b) down. Not so much
> for ©
> >
> >Eric, I sure do appreciate your ideas below, but don't forget incubator
> helps in making legally complaint releases. Releases distinguish incubator
> from apache labs. And making frequent releases and announcing them is one
> the best marketing technique which sells open source software. In that
> sense,  of course the developers have great skill at this aspect of
> marketing :)
> >
> >Suresh
> >
> >> For example:
> >>
> >> What does it mean to do "press"? What would you include in a press
> release? Where would you send it?
> >>
> >> Apache has so many projects, shouldn't it do a monthly "highlight on
> _____" report, calling out a top level project, and a project being
> incubated? Automatic publicity! Expect incubating projects to participate
> in one of those "highlight" reports before graduating....
> >>
> >> What community events should a team focus on? What have teams done in
> the past? What has worked? What hasn't worked? Do we know why it worked or
> didn't work? Is this information being recorded anywhere?
> >>
> >> Encourage teams to shamelessly request "reference" users that they can
> post to their websites. Solicit "endorsements" from "neutral" third parties.
> >>
> >> I've seen ideas tossed around on the incubator list, but generally
> nothing concrete, so it feels to me like the projects are left drifting in
> the wind, trying to figure this stuff out for themselves.
> >>
> >> That's silly, because Apache has such huge name recognition in the
> software world, it should be *easy* to draw attention to incubating
> projects. Except that at the moment, the best way to follow what's
> incubating seems to be hopping on this general list, where you will see
> when projects submit proposals, see them voted on, and see when they get in
> trouble. That's a lot of noise for a small amount of signal. Capturing that
> signal publicly might help bring visibility to the projects to follow.
> >>
> >> For example, why doesn't the incubator have a twitter feed where the
> status of incubating projects gets reported? Something that everyone can
> follow, and discover when new projects are proposed, when projects are at
> risk, and when they think about graduating?
> >>
> >> Recognizing that everyone here has limited resources, I don't think
> what's needed here is much more than a little bit of capturing existing
> known data on a wiki page or three, perhaps a twitter feed, and some small
> amount of nudging by mentors. At least as a start!
> >>
> >> Eric.
> >>
> >> [1] https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/gXMLProposal
> >>
> >> On 11/26/12 8:03 PM, Alan Cabrera wrote:
> >>> I wonder if we can ask that incubation proposals include how they
> intend to get the message out there.  What channels are relevant for the
> project?  I guess what are their marketing plans.
> >>>
> >>> Eventually, we'd have a collection of old incubation proposals that
> new podlings could use to garner ideas on how to market and grow their
> community.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Regards,
> >>> Alan
> >>>
> >>> On Nov 26, 2012, at 5:50 PM, Ross Gardler wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Growing community is about "getting the message out there". There has
> to be someone in the project who wants to do that. Some techniques are:
> >>>>
> >>>> - press
> >>>> - community events
> >>>> - mentoring (that is mentoring of potential new committers)
> >>>> - fast turnaround on patch reviews
> >>>> - regular releases
> >>>> - decent website
> >>>> - tutorials
> >>>> - screencasts
> >>>> - public discussion (even with self while no community exists)
> >>>>
> >>>> Developing code for one's own use is all well can good but it does
> not build community and trying to build community doesn't, in the short
> term, write code. It's a catch-22.
> >>>>
> >>>> Personally I have no problem with a podling having low activity. A
> single developer doing their thing in the incubator is not going to hurt
> anyone. What I'm concerned about is a podling that is not doing any of the
> above community development activities or, even worse, is ignoring
> potential contributors.
> >>>>
> >>>> I don't think it is the responsibility of ComDev to do this, although
> one could argue ComDev should be documenting these techniques in ways
> useful to mentors. I don't think it is the job of mentors (or the IPMC) to
> do this either. It is entirely the PPMC responsibility. In my opinion.
> >>>>
> >>>> Ross
> >>>>
> >>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>> From: Benson Margulies [mailto:bimargulies@gmail.com]
> >>>>> Sent: 27 November 2012 00:22
> >>>>> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> >>>>> Subject: Re: How to grow podling communities
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Luciano,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> My five cents is this: growing communities is really, really, hard,
> and I don't
> >>>>> know that anyone at Apache has a recipe. If anyone does, it might
be
> the
> >>>>> comdev committee. I'm not sure that this PMC can take it on. We
can
> barely
> >>>>> muster the minimal supervision that the board requires of us. If
a
> PPMC
> >>>>> wants help, it might be good for it to make contact with comdev.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I hate to be such a pessimist, but I think that the incubator has
to
> continue to
> >>>>> shrink until the number of podlings is in balance with the available
> >>>>> supervisory/mentor effort. At that point, maybe we can consider
> consider
> >>>>> more of an effort to support in addition to supervising.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Just, however, my opinion.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 3:58 PM, Luciano Resende <
> luckbr1975@gmail.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> >>>>>> From: *Benson Margulies*
> >>>>>> Date: Monday, November 26, 2012
> >>>>>> Subject: [VOTE] Retire Chukwa from incubation
> >>>>>> To: "general@incubator.apache.org" <general@incubator.apache.org>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> For those voting -1, I'd like to see, on another thread, some
> >>>>>> discussion about just how we handle podlings where there are
> >>>>>> longstanding issues but no consensus on the PPMC. We've heading
in
> the
> >>>>>> same direction on Photark, and some consensus about how or when
to
> >>>>>> reach a respectful conclusion as a PMC that a project should
be
> >>>>>> retired even if the PPMC is not of the same opinion would be
useful.
> >>>>>> We cannot both say that we need projects to have active,
> supervising,
> >>>>>> mentors and shepherds and then not, in some fashion, act on
what
> they
> >>>>>> tell us.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -----
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I believe that the discussion we should have is how can we help
> >>>>>> struggling podlings to grow their community in a sustentable
way.
> >>>>>> Recently, I have seen an increase in trying to push small
> communities
> >>>>>> to retirement, but i'm yet to see active mentors engaging and
> helping
> >>>>>> and motivating the podlings PPMC to find ways to grow.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Growing communities when a project is backed by corporations
that
> >>>>>> sponsor engineers to devote their full time volunteering at
the
> >>>>>> project is much easier compared to those other projects that
are
> >>>>>> developed by a small group of people, that devote their own
free
> time
> >>>>>> and are passionate by the Apache brand, and doing truly open
source
> >>>>> following the Apache Way.
> >>>>>> With my Community development hat, I would really like to see
a wide
> >>>>>> discussion on how the IPMC and COMDEV PMC could find ways to
help
> >>>>>> these struggling podlings succeed, instead of just giving ultimates
> >>>>>> for seeking retirement. Things that come to mind are : make
it
> easier
> >>>>>> for new contributors to find tasks that they could work on,
more
> >>>>>> visibility for podlings in Apache sponsored conferences, etc
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thoughts ? Other possible ideas ?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Luciano Resende
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Luciano Resende
> >>>>>> http://people.apache.org/~lresende
> >>>>>> http://twitter.com/lresende1975
> >>>>>> http://lresende.blogspot.com/
> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

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