From general-return-35162-apmail-incubator-general-archive=incubator.apache.org@incubator.apache.org Mon Apr 2 16:54:10 2012 Return-Path: X-Original-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Received: from mail.apache.org (hermes.apache.org [140.211.11.3]) by minotaur.apache.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 575AF933E for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2012 16:54:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: (qmail 98957 invoked by uid 500); 2 Apr 2012 16:54:09 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 98711 invoked by uid 500); 2 Apr 2012 16:54:08 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list general@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 98702 invoked by uid 99); 2 Apr 2012 16:54:08 -0000 Received: from athena.apache.org (HELO athena.apache.org) (140.211.11.136) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 02 Apr 2012 16:54:08 +0000 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=-0.7 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (athena.apache.org: domain of bimargulies@gmail.com designates 209.85.212.169 as permitted sender) Received: from [209.85.212.169] (HELO mail-wi0-f169.google.com) (209.85.212.169) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 02 Apr 2012 16:54:03 +0000 Received: by wibhm17 with SMTP id hm17so2569454wib.0 for ; Mon, 02 Apr 2012 09:53:42 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=H1HGPPUazw/qtlV3rDcMrlbncOTsbI3PxUTJPRHmqdY=; b=oFyw2sESUZw7sVHEY8MAcolyGYgCDUM6miDc/UsxpVB4V3DoHCuRb2ZiL79qpxEAVl tOowdAo538dKnShW962IA/05JVdiagGEWbHraBJN/Qi8q5b+94UKiKicYIH6tTYY7ptj ehSPObfVRk8qSLVBLQF+fv9p2xEWD33NzY0lq7uaXIQq+3qtVM7eQ5p8sHy76RSx8S4K oDoJ+nLxeSaSNuo4elcnuMMCAvlrSr4GYBBH+2bhWuSA4/9bXkYULac4tF55U8YWFNmj +JDFQELznN20cI3zIbgDHHA0s0II7NUMZhSgWPXxp/J1nHSmL8jweL4AQCrf/oAmY8J6 lAxA== MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.180.24.35 with SMTP id r3mr27428922wif.7.1333385621569; Mon, 02 Apr 2012 09:53:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.180.146.68 with HTTP; Mon, 2 Apr 2012 09:53:41 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <20120402153132.GE4297@daniel3.local> <20120402153555.GF4297@daniel3.local> <20120402161636.GG4297@daniel3.local> <20120402162625.GH4297@daniel3.local> Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2012 12:53:41 -0400 Message-ID: Subject: Re: Question about downloading binaries From: Benson Margulies To: Karl Wright , general@incubator.apache.org Cc: Daniel Shahaf , infrastructure@apache.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org Karl, I hope that you are making this too hard. We don't care about the contents of someone else's binaries. If you make and deploy a -deps package of third-party binaries, as a convenience for your users, it can contain any strange mixture of sources and binaries it contains. If you provide a script to download a third-party package, we don't care what it downloads so long as the license is acceptable for a dependency. I don't follow the logic that prevents you from having a release manager: a) retrieve third-part sources b) apply your patches from your svn c) create -deps bundle d) deploy to dist, appropriately marked as 'not an Apache release', so long as the third-party material has an acceptable license in the first place. In case I'm wrong here, I'll ask: what is the build tool of choice for ManifoldCF? On the other hand from all of these, perhaps there is, or could be, a plugin for that build tool that could implement the 'patch' utility for you on Windows? On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Karl Wright wrote: > Sorry about the list cc'ing - the gmail client is fighting me today. > > To try and clarify, which will take some time I'm afraid: > > (1) The 0.5 version of the ManifoldCF release candidate was rejected > because the tar contained binary dependencies. =C2=A0The binary > dependencies were checked into svn. =C2=A0This has been standard practice > for a decade or more for Java projects built with ant, but has now > been deemed unacceptable. > (2) In trying to find a solution which would still be convenient but > not include binaries, we considered supplying ant logic that downloads > the dependencies on demand. =C2=A0The download would use binaries from th= e > Maven repository, where possible. > (3) In some cases, there is either no corresponding jar in the Maven > repository, or there is a jar but it doesn't include critical patches. > (4) In these cases, we needed to see whether there was another place > those dependent jars could live. =C2=A0They were in svn before, so one > possibility was that they remain there. =C2=A0Other possibilities include > putting them into a googlecode repository, or downloading and building > them as part of the overall build process. > > > > Hope this helps. > Karl > > > On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 12:26 PM, Daniel Shahaf w= rote: >> Forward to list >> >> I can't answer your question as it's too abstract. =C2=A0I don't underst= and >> what you're trying to do from either infra@ or legal@ perspective. >> >> Karl Wright wrote on Mon, Apr 02, 2012 at 12:21:17 -0400: >>> "'svn patch' exists in 1.7." >>> >>> Ok, so that implies that we would create the patched jar by checking >>> out the project tag from svn and using svn patch, not by downloading >>> the source tarball. =C2=A0Do you think it is ok to allow svn access as = part >>> of a project's build process? >>> >>> Karl >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 12:16 PM, Daniel Shahaf = wrote: >>> > 'svn patch' exists in 1.7. =C2=A0(and tortoise includes svn.exe as an >>> > optional component, I hear) >>> > >>> > Karl Wright wrote on Mon, Apr 02, 2012 at 12:05:47 -0400: >>> >> The patches are contained in SVN, yes, but the build process is >>> >> structured to work on Windows as well as Linux, and there isn't a >>> >> standard patch utility on Windows. >>> >> >>> >> We could insist that people only build on Linux, I suppose, but that >>> >> would be a huge inconvenience for a lot of people. >>> >> >>> >> Karl >>> >> >>> >> On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 11:47 AM, sebb wrote: >>> >> > On 2 April 2012 16:36, Karl Wright wrote: >>> >> >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >>> >> >> From: Daniel Shahaf >>> >> >> Date: Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 11:35 AM >>> >> >> Subject: Re: Question about downloading binaries >>> >> >> To: Karl Wright >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> You didn't CC the list >>> >> >> >>> >> >> Karl Wright wrote on Mon, Apr 02, 2012 at 11:33:56 -0400: >>> >> >>> The patches for the dependencies for the main release are source= d only >>> >> >>> as part of the project in question at this time. =C2=A0So there = is no other >>> >> >>> logical place for them to live. >>> >> > >>> >> > The project SVN presumably contains the patches? >>> >> > If not, it should. >>> >> > >>> >> > In which case, can't you download the source and apply the patches= as >>> >> > part of the build process? >>> >> > >>> >> > This is what the Tomcat project does (though it's not changing cod= e, >>> >> > just changing package names to avoid collisions). >>> >> > >>> >> >>> Karl >>> >> >>> >>> >> >>> On Mon, Apr 2, 2012 at 11:31 AM, Daniel Shahaf wrote: >>> >> >>> > Why do they have to be hosted on Apache infrastructure? =C2=A0= The Subversion >>> >> >>> > build depends on a C compiler but we don't host that on ASF ha= rdware. >>> >> >>> > >>> >> >>> > Karl Wright wrote on Mon, Apr 02, 2012 at 11:16:22 -0400: >>> >> >>> >> Hi folks, >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> As a result of a change in the way Java releases must be stru= ctured, >>> >> >>> >> we need to be able to download binary dependencies as part of= the >>> >> >>> >> build process. =C2=A0The problem is that we have some binary = dependencies >>> >> >>> >> that contain patches, or are otherwise unsuitable for being p= ushed to >>> >> >>> >> the Maven repository. =C2=A0What is the best place in the Apa= che >>> >> >>> >> infrastructure for keeping dependencies like this? >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> Thanks, >>> >> >>> >> Karl --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org