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From Joe Schaefer <joe_schae...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: Does Apache Have a 'Rule' Problem, or does the Incubator sometimes just make it look that way?
Date Thu, 24 Nov 2011 16:09:04 GMT
----- Original Message -----

> From: sebb <sebbaz@gmail.com>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org; Joe Schaefer <joe_schaefer@yahoo.com>
> Cc: 
> Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 11:07 AM
> Subject: Re: Does Apache Have a 'Rule' Problem, or does the Incubator sometimes just
make it look that way?
> 
> On 24 November 2011 15:18, Joe Schaefer <joe_schaefer@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>  Coordination problems (getting everyone here on the same page)
>>  require community documentation and constant pointers to said
>>  documentation in order to be fully resolved.
>> 
>>  Whenever we find ourselves making contradicting statements over
>>  time, the healthy thing to do is to put together such a document
>>  on the wiki or on the site that explains what happened and how
>>  we resolved it.
> 
> Indeed, that is mainly why Ant and I raised questions on board@ about
> what a release means, and for clarifications on the Release FAQ.

Personally I am always reluctant to make spur-of-the-moment changes
to that doc, as the current prose represents an uneasy compromise
worked out over a long period of time.


> 
> Unfortunately, there was no definitive conclusion to the thread, and
> no clarifications of the FAQ.
> 
>> 
>>  Simply referring to past emails here is inconclusive at best
>>  unless they are comments from the chair.
> 
> +1
> 
>>  YMMV
>> 
>> 
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>>>  From: Benson Margulies <bimargulies@gmail.com>
>>>  To: general@incubator.apache.org
>>>  Cc:
>>>  Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 10:14 AM
>>>  Subject: Does Apache Have a 'Rule' Problem, or does the 
> Incubator sometimes just make it look that way?
>>> 
>>>  When the hot air manufacturers start ragging on us, one of the usual
>>>  tags that they paint is 'rules' and 'bureaucracy'. If 
> you read
>>>  general@, you will see a fairly regular occurrence that feeds this
>>>  perception.
>>> 
>>>  Someone poses a question about NOTICE files, or IP, or release 
> structure.
>>> 
>>>  If they are lucky, they get 3 disagreeing responses in short order.
>>>  Why lucky? Because that gives them a clue that perhaps none of them
>>>  are the right answer. If they are unlucky, they get a one answer,
>>>  confidently worded. And then they put in hours of work based on that
>>>  answer.
>>> 
>>>  Time passes. A release, or even a graduation vote arrives. Suddenly,
>>>  some crusty veteran arrives on the scene to tell them that what
>>>  they've done is wrong, or inadequate, or purple.
>>> 
>>>  This is not precisely wonderful from a PR standpoint.
>>> 
>>>  What can we do as a PMC to improve this?
>>> 
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>> 
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>> 
> 

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