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From Joe Schaefer <joe_schae...@yahoo.com>
Subject Re: [VOTE] Graduate ACE from the Apache Incubator
Date Mon, 21 Nov 2011 15:31:25 GMT
I'm confused.  In /dist/incubator/ace/, there appears
to be an *.incubator-sources.* file for each independent
module in the release.  Are those not actually what they
are advertised to be?  What exactly is the problem with
the previous release?




>________________________________
> From: Alex Karasulu <akarasulu@apache.org>
>To: general@incubator.apache.org 
>Sent: Monday, November 21, 2011 10:23 AM
>Subject: Re: [VOTE] Graduate ACE from the Apache Incubator
> 
>On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 5:18 PM, Karl Pauls <karlpauls@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 4:11 PM, ant elder <ant.elder@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 3:03 PM, Richard S. Hall <heavy@ungoverned.org>
>> wrote:
>> >> On 11/21/11 09:41 , ant elder wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 2:18 PM, Karl Pauls<karlpauls@gmail.com>
>>  wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Mon, Nov 21, 2011 at 3:08 PM, ant elder<antelder@apache.org>
>>  wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Well IMHO i don't think this release demonstrates that the poddling
>> >>>>> has an understanding of making or reviewing ASF releases and
thats
>> the
>> >>>>> point of requiring releases during incubation.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> So you want us to do a new release? Fine, whatever, we can just
roll a
>> >>>> new release which has the source distribution configured. That was
a
>> >>>> mistake in the first place as it makes the bundles not easily
>> >>>> individually buildable.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> However, we still will not have a combined source release as we
want
>> >>>> to be able to release our bundles individually. Is that the resolution
>> >>>> then? All we have to do is a do a micro release with the source
>> >>>> distribution configured on a per artifact level?
>> >>>>
>> >>> I agree the requirement for a single source release doesn't seem
>> >>> totally clear, I've said I think you should have one and so has sebb,
>> >>> it would be good to hear what other Incubator PMC people think. I
>> >>> think you need one for two main reasons:
>> >>>
>> >>> 1) The ASF deals with source and the releases are how users get hold
>> >>> of that source. If a user is going to do development with the released
>> >>> ACE source they likely aren't going to be able to do very much useful
>> >>> with just single things like org.apache.ace.repository.imp. At the
>> >>> very least they're probably going to want
>> >>> org.apache.ace.repository.api too but likely there is a big network
of
>> >>> the 60 something ACE modules that anyone doing most non-trivial ACE
>> >>> development is going to want. One source distribution makes this easy,
>> >>> making them have to download them all separately isn't particularly
>> >>> practical. That https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/ace/trunk/
>> >>> is structured so the ASF committers can work with them as one single
>> >>> buildable checkout i think shows thats true.
>> >>>
>> >>> 2) If there is only individually buildable source for each jar how are
>> >>> people really going to verify that the release is actually buildable
>> >>> and the artifacts match the SVN tag source when reviewing and voting
>> >>> on release votes? No one reviewing is really likely to download 60
>> >>> separate distros and build them all one by one are they?
>> >>
>> >> I disagree. There seems to be some misunderstanding that there is one
>> single
>> >> product that must be built.
>> >>
>> >> When you develop independently evolving modules, "big bang" releases do
>> not
>> >> make sense. Each module has its own release cycle. Occasionally you may
>> end
>> >> up creating some sort of "distribution" out of the modules and release
>> that,
>> >> but that is just one potential distribution.
>> >>
>> >
>> > I agree thats an approach used and works in many projects but if that
>> > was really the case _here_  then surely the SVN would be structured so
>> > that there were separate trunk/branch/tag folders for each module,
>> > there would have been more releases than just the single 0.8.0
>> > release, and there would be separate release votes for each module
>> > being released.
>>
>> We have a tag per module and that is enough. Furthermore, we do
>> combine several modules if it makes sense (i.e., we want to release
>> them at the same time) in one vote as it would otherwise create a lot
>> of extra traffic. That's all. It is the same set-up some of the other
>> OSGi projects at the asf have (I did quite a lot of their releases).
>> The only thing we missed was the source distributions per artifact.
>>
>>
>And that IMHO is not enough to consider the release a failure. Let it be
>noted and corrected for future releases. AFAIC there's no reason to hold
>this podling back because of some minor release inconsistencies which are
>natural as we shift from monolithic products to component based OSGi
>products.
>
>Best,
>Alex
>
>
>
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