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From Ross Gardler <rgard...@apache.org>
Subject Re: Radical revamp (was: an experiment)
Date Tue, 17 Aug 2010 08:14:02 GMT
On 17 Aug 2010, at 03:53, Joe Schaefer <joe_schaefer@yahoo.com> wrote:

> It's optimized for success while making mentors potentially responsible for failure (iow
a project with crappy mentors will fail no matter how much they grok apache).  Still have
doubts about escalating the graduation decision to the board.
> 

I don't see this proposal replacing the IPMC. The project can turn there for help if they
choose (eg our mentors are absent).

I see the IPMC role becoming more of a training ground for mentors than a police force. 


> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Aug 16, 2010, at 10:46 PM, Greg Stein <gstein@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 22:31, Joe Schaefer <joe_schaefer@yahoo.com> wrote:
> ----- Original Message ----
> 
> From: Noel J. Bergman <noel@devtech.com>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Sent: Mon, August 16, 2010 10:00:40 PM
> Subject: RE: Radical revamp (was: an experiment)
> 
> Greg Stein wrote:
> 
> Using  this model decentralizes the process
> 
> So does having 3+ PMC Members  today.
> 
> To me this is a common flaw in both how the IPMC operates today and how
> Greg's proposal relies on 3 Members to get anything accomplished.  If
> you've been paying attention to what actually happens in this PMC over
> time,  you can't possibly have missed all the begging for votes that
> goes on.
> 
> Reliance on 3 overworked people who are typically not podling committers
> to always be there when the project needs them is both unrealistic and
> doesn't scale.  We've been doing it for years, inflicting massive
> pain on the podlings whenever they release or want new committers,
> and it sucks.  That's what my experiment aims to fix.
> 
> I hear you, and I think that *if* you have 3+ *active* ASF Members,
> then my approach will dramatically improve the process. Also, those
> Members in the hot seat are going to be more active because they
> *know* they're on the hook. There is nobody to "pass the buck" to.
> They are part of the reports to the Board ("One of our PMC Members,
> John Doe, has been absent."). If a project has the support, then this
> gets the "second-guessing" of the IPMC and the second-level of
> unnecessary "oversight" out of the way. It directly introduces the
> project to its future place within the organization.
> 
> Cheers,
> -g
> 
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