From general-return-22106-apmail-incubator-general-archive=incubator.apache.org@incubator.apache.org Sat May 23 19:03:01 2009 Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 70926 invoked from network); 23 May 2009 19:03:00 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (140.211.11.3) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 23 May 2009 19:03:00 -0000 Received: (qmail 74753 invoked by uid 500); 23 May 2009 19:03:12 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 74551 invoked by uid 500); 23 May 2009 19:03:11 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list general@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 74541 invoked by uid 99); 23 May 2009 19:03:11 -0000 Received: from nike.apache.org (HELO nike.apache.org) (192.87.106.230) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sat, 23 May 2009 19:03:11 +0000 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=10.0 tests=SPF_NEUTRAL X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: neutral (nike.apache.org: local policy) Received: from [209.85.220.172] (HELO mail-fx0-f172.google.com) (209.85.220.172) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Sat, 23 May 2009 19:03:00 +0000 Received: by fxm20 with SMTP id 20so2342203fxm.12 for ; Sat, 23 May 2009 12:02:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.90.2 with SMTP id n2mr4205564fgb.39.1243105359928; Sat, 23 May 2009 12:02:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?192.168.2.101? (p57BC429E.dip.t-dialin.net [87.188.66.158]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id e20sm2968824fga.10.2009.05.23.12.02.35 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sat, 23 May 2009 12:02:38 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Leo Simons Message-Id: From: Leo Simons To: general@incubator.apache.org In-Reply-To: <1242903823.24313.1707.camel@urgyen> Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-1-657664968; micalg=sha1; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v935.3) Subject: Re: [VOTE] Approve the release of Shindig Incubator 1.0 Date: Sat, 23 May 2009 21:02:33 +0200 References: <25aac9fc0905111011l3e809084w80b29a5b3e543366@mail.gmail.com> <25aac9fc0905111624s32b424ccl14eed84b4a93e19a@mail.gmail.com> <25aac9fc0905120251pb8afc14l30af80f736fbc5ef@mail.gmail.com> <9ae367340905120340u28193149wd591731e4ea23cc4@mail.gmail.com> <25aac9fc0905120525kb0c8406qe4f9eea54fbd151d@mail.gmail.com> <1242903823.24313.1707.camel@urgyen> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.935.3) X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org --Apple-Mail-1-657664968 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On May 21, 2009, at 1:03 PM, Upayavira wrote: > I am a mentor for Shindig, but I am aware of a weaknesses of mine as a > mentor is that I'm not that knowledgeable or experienced with the > release process at Apache, and therefore have not followed this thread > in detail, which I really should have. > > It seems that this release is stalled, but I am not entirely sure how, > and want to understand this better. Sebb has raised some valid concerns; some were addressed, some are left; shindig has to address those concerns, but up new artifacts, and then ask for another vote. > The thing that confuses me is that, as I understand it, Shindig is > just > using Maven to produce its artefacts (binary jars as a convenience to > users). If that is the case, surely those artefacts are structured in > the same way as other Maven based releases from other projects? The apache-hosted maven-based projects I've checked (including maven itself!) only officially release source archives. As Jason pointed out, this is now pretty easy to do in accordance with policy, thanks to some plugin work David did quite a while ago. To release binary archives that embed third-party dependencies is more work. The LICENSE and NOTICE file have to have details about dependencies, if those dependencies are in the binary distributions. With maven, automatic resolution of transitive dependencies is possible, which shindig relies on. However, there is not automatic resolution of licensing details, which makes crossing the legal t's and dotting the legal i's quite a chore. > Is it that we have identified a new issue that actually affects > _all_ Maven based releases, not just Shindig? No not necessarily. You can use maven to produce binary releases that have all the required legal details inside of them; it just isn't automatically taken care of. > If so, how can we both unblock the Shindig release Shindig can choose to either do the work to get the legal bits and pieces related to their dependencies sorted out and produce binary releases that follow the rules, or they can opt to do a source-only release. > and also get this issue resolved in such a way as it covers all > Maven based projects? To solve this issue in a way that covers all maven-based projects requires making sure that all required legal details and notices are put inside the maven repositories in a machine-processable manner, for all artifacts, and then modifying a maven plugin or two to aggregate those details automagically, and then to make use of that plugin everywhere. In other words, that's a few months of work at the least :-) cheers, - Leo --Apple-Mail-1-657664968 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIOyjCCBJMw ggN7oAMCAQICCHhPTvImOnFMMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBBQUAMIGQMQswCQYDVQQGEwJHQjEPMA0GA1UE BwwGTG9uZG9uMSkwJwYDVQQKDCBCcml0aXNoIEJyb2FkY2FzdGluZyBDb3Jwb3JhdGlvbjEXMBUG A1UECwwORk1UIEdyZWVuaG91c2UxLDAqBgNVBAMMI0JCQyBHcmVlbmhvdXNlIERldmVsb3BtZW50 IFN0YWZmIENBMB4XDTA5MDUwNTA5MjQwNloXDTA5MDgwMzA5MjQwNlowgYwxITAfBgkqhkiG9w0B CQEWEm1haWxAbGVvc2ltb25zLmNvbTETMBEGA1UEAwwKTGVvIFNpbW9uczEeMBwGA1UECwwVU3Vw cGxpZXIgdG8gQkJDIC0gRk1UMRQwEgYDVQQKDAtJbmRlcGVuZGVudDEPMA0GA1UEBwwGTG9uZG9u MQswCQYDVQQGEwJHQjCCASIwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEBBQADggEPADCCAQoCggEBAKU67dqUe49euPoT oO5/HI7Bs2SBBscxlOC6Lk7tTLVd6qcJm+27aDf761QRj2qVkjeC6itjdiqGXCs3dO6cP9NUDRI2 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