From general-return-20937-apmail-incubator-general-archive=incubator.apache.org@incubator.apache.org Fri Dec 19 19:21:41 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 60810 invoked from network); 19 Dec 2008 19:21:39 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (140.211.11.2) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 19 Dec 2008 19:21:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 95245 invoked by uid 500); 19 Dec 2008 19:21:50 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 95100 invoked by uid 500); 19 Dec 2008 19:21:49 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list general@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 95088 invoked by uid 99); 19 Dec 2008 19:21:49 -0000 Received: from nike.apache.org (HELO nike.apache.org) (192.87.106.230) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Dec 2008 11:21:49 -0800 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=10.0 tests=FORGED_MUA_OIMO,MSGID_FROM_MTA_HEADER,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (nike.apache.org: local policy) Received: from [66.112.202.4] (HELO mail.devtech.com) (66.112.202.4) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Dec 2008 19:21:29 +0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MessageIsInfected: false Received: from mail.devtech.com. ([66.112.202.4]) by mail.devtech.com (JAMES SMTP Server 2.3.1-dev) with SMTP ID 464 for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2008 14:21:08 -0500 (EST) From: "Noel J. Bergman" To: Subject: Pivot Proposal Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 14:21:07 -0500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <145860315204915445128475229034327627369-Webmail@me.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3350 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org Greg Brown wrote: > We'll put together a draft proposal Which is now at http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/PivotProposal. All in all, appears to be a very nice proposal. :-) You might want to reorganize and elaborate a bit. In particular, you list Flex, Silverlight, and OpenLazlo up top, but you don't appear to compare against them, whereas JavaFX is mentioned and compared against in a sort of buried location, and are others in the Java RIA space, such as GWT, are not mentioned at all. I'd also be interested to know how you feel it might relate to projects such as MyFaces (JSF) where one could imagine rich client components as plums in a JSP pudding. Given your own references to AJAX and the existence of AJAX components for JSF, the question seems begged. Have you done anything about allowing WS-* (WSDL) Web Services, in addition to REST style? Are there any issues? Or would we use REST to reach server-side, and go to WS-* type service from the server? Am I correct that you require a client-side JRE? I do not have an issue with it, I just want to confirm what I'm seeing. To the contrary, I've argued that JavaScript is what is wrong with AJAX, and that we need a Java-based solution, thus providing a proper security model for the application code being loaded into the browser. So this looks quite appealing so far, although startup time is slower than I would like, and I am wondering about footprint. Given that the core of your client side appears to be a Java Applet, you might wish to know that I have been to your site and been running the demos under Firefox 3 with Sun's newly released 64-bit Java plugin for linux. --- Noel --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org