From general-return-20558-apmail-incubator-general-archive=incubator.apache.org@incubator.apache.org Mon Nov 10 15:51:17 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 62494 invoked from network); 10 Nov 2008 15:51:15 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (140.211.11.2) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 10 Nov 2008 15:51:15 -0000 Received: (qmail 21427 invoked by uid 500); 10 Nov 2008 15:51:20 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 21039 invoked by uid 500); 10 Nov 2008 15:51:18 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list general@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 21020 invoked by uid 99); 10 Nov 2008 15:51:18 -0000 Received: from athena.apache.org (HELO athena.apache.org) (140.211.11.136) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 10 Nov 2008 07:51:18 -0800 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=-1.0 required=10.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (athena.apache.org: domain of Serge.Mankovskii@ca.com designates 208.232.182.54 as permitted sender) Received: from [208.232.182.54] (HELO mail15.ca.com) (208.232.182.54) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 10 Nov 2008 15:49:56 +0000 Received: from USILMS15.ca.com ([141.202.201.58]) by mail15.ca.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 10 Nov 2008 09:50:18 -0600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: POLOKA proposal in context of existing Apache projects Date: Mon, 10 Nov 2008 10:50:12 -0500 Message-ID: <338048A2D5D9A04E921BE8AD5C04984F05CD6C24@USILMS15.ca.com> In-Reply-To: <49160AE7.7030508@opensource.lk> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: POLOKA proposal in context of existing Apache projects Thread-Index: AclCDyWM5UXfmUcVSPaEE32hugaxEQBO18Cw References: <338048A2D5D9A04E921BE8AD5C04984F05CD6921@USILMS15.ca.com> <19e0530f0811071341o5d5e00d7k5933c21bdd2df690@mail.gmail.com> <4914C06C.9000802@gmail.com> <49150B54.1090103@opensource.lk> <338048A2D5D9A04E921BE8AD5C04984F05CD6A1F@USILMS15.ca.com> <49160AE7.7030508@opensource.lk> From: "Mankovskii, Serge" To: Cc: , , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Nov 2008 15:50:18.0155 (UTC) FILETIME=[07A43FB0:01C9434C] X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org Hi Sanjiva, I think there is a lot of synergy between open source community and university community. It is an interesting discussion to have. I am talking to Ontario agencies responsible for innovation in the province on that. We are thinking about a framework that would help to foster university/open source connection and help it grow. Thank you fro the offer to mentor the project. In respect to a Champion, I will follow in both directions. I will post the request in the private@ws.apache.org and also will try to request Incubator PMC to Champion the project. I am not sure how to request the PMC though. =20 Cheers Serge -----Original Message----- From: Sanjiva Weerawarana [mailto:sanjiva@opensource.lk]=20 Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2008 4:56 PM To: Mankovskii, Serge Cc: general@incubator.apache.org; savan-dev@ws.apache.org; dev@servicemix.apache.org; axis-dev@ws.apache.org Subject: Re: POLOKA proposal in context of existing Apache projects Hi Serge, Sorry to not have recognized the name .. small world eh? :-). OK now I understand the project - I've been long advocating universities to participate in open source as I see universities as our research=20 division! That's the way we can beat any corporate research division ;-). I'm happy to mentor it and champion it. However, let me try to find=20 another champion though just because of practical time issues .. In terms of sponsor- if you want the WS PMC to sponsor it then you need to=20 make the request to private@ws.apache.org. Alternatively, we can ask the Incubator PMC to sponsor it .. IMO that's easier and that sort of gives=20 you more flexibility in deciding your final ASF home upon graduation. Sanjiva. Mankovskii, Serge wrote: > Hi Sanjiva, >=20 > It is great to hear from you! I think we've met during EDCIS 2002 in > Beijing. Arno Jacobsen was there too. It looks like you know Peter > Niblett for a while as well! >=20 > It looks like at the movement that we are not able to secure a member of > Apache that would Champion and Sponsor us. I think we need to ask PMC to > do that. Can you help us there? >=20 > Yes, there is code, and a lot of it. But the code is focused on the > pub/sub matching, messaging, and federation. It does not use any of WS > stack at the moment and it does not follow any standards. We are going > to release this code and then work it into the standards stack. It will > bring results of six year research into the open source in a way that > everybody would be able to use it.=20 >=20 > Reference Implementation means that within the project there will be it > will be a distribution that would contain all that WS-N stack requires > and no more or no less than that. To accomplish this objective within > MUSE without totally re-implementing it might be a problem.=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Cheers > Serge >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: Sanjiva Weerawarana [mailto:sanjiva@opensource.lk]=20 > Sent: Friday, November 07, 2008 10:45 PM > To: general@incubator.apache.org > Cc: Mankovskii, Serge; savan-dev@ws.apache.org; > dev@servicemix.apache.org; axis-dev@ws.apache.org > Subject: Re: POLOKA proposal in context of existing Apache projects >=20 > Deepal, that's cart before the horse .. this project needs to get to=20 > graduation first :). >=20 > Serge, are you asking for the WS PMC to sponsor this project for > incubation? >=20 > If so, how does this relate to the WS-Notification impl we already have > on=20 > top of Axis2? (Muse?) Having one by no means does not mean there can't > be=20 > another; just trying to understand the relationship. >=20 > Is there code already developed that you're looking to contribute to the >=20 > ASF? Or are you proposing to write new code?? The first line of the=20 > proposal starts with "Poloka will be a standalone reference > implementation=20 > ..". Later text suggests there's working code, but if there is no > working=20 > code the right model is to join the existing community and build on that >=20 > codebase. >=20 > What does "reference implementation" mean? >=20 > [Hi Peter (Niblett)! Long time :) ..] >=20 > Sanjiva. >=20 > Deepal jayasinghe wrote: >> I think we can keep this as the same level as Sandesha and Ramparrt. I >> mean we do not have any modules other than core stuff under Axis2. >> >> Deepal >>> Serge, >>> >>> Unfortunately i won't be able to help much at this time due to time >>> pressures. Hopefully one of my fellow PMC members may be interested > in >>> moving this forward. Best Wishes. >>> >>> thanks, >>> dims >>> >>> On Fri, Nov 7, 2008 at 3:54 PM, Mankovskii, Serge >>> wrote: >>> =20 >>>> Hi Davanum, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> In our search for a Champion and Sponsor for the Poloka proposal >>>> http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/PolokaProposal We looked into the > Savan, >>>> ServiceMix, Axis2, and MUSE projects. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> We find that it makes most sense, so far, to have Poloka as a > project under >>>> Axis2. It also makes sense to go into the ServiceMix, that > implements >>>> WS-Notification already, but objectives of ServiceMix and POLOKA are >>>> somewhat different in respect to POLOKA goal to provide a > stand-alone >>>> reference implementation of the spec. Bringing entire ServiceMix in > the >>>> picture might be too much. However ServiceMix could benefit from the > POLOKA >>>> work in the future. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Poloka (http://poloka.org) could create an Axis2 module implementing >>>> handlers creating a messaging network for a federation of Axis2 > servers. >>>> This way we would be able to support >>>> >>>> - Standalone WS-Notification compliant notification producer > and >>>> notification consumer >>>> >>>> - Standalone WS-BrokeredNotification broker >>>> >>>> - Federation of WS-BrokeredNotification brokers. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> It would make sense to integrate Savan functionality within Poloka > as time >>>> goes but not other way around. I think so because Poloka objective > is >>>> broader than Savan objective in respect to: >>>> >>>> - Broker support >>>> >>>> Broker support is defined in WS-Notification and not in WS-Eventing. >>>> Although it is possible that once a broker with WS-Eventing > interface is >>>> created, the picture might change. >>>> >>>> - Subscription >>>> >>>> WS-Eventing defines subscription language based on XPath > (content-based >>>> semantic). WS-Notification defines subscription Filers using Topic > Dialects >>>> (topic-based semantic), XPath over message content (content-based > semantic, >>>> same as in WS-Eventing), and resource properties (optional and > unclear >>>> semantics, needs refinement in the spec). >>>> >>>> - Matching performance >>>> >>>> It seems that we can improve performance of XPath matching based on > the >>>> research done by the PADRES > http://research.msrg.utoronto.ca/pub/Padres >>>> project. It would be equally applicable to WS-Notification and > WS-Eventing. >>>> Naweed Tajuddin, a Master student of Prof. Arno Jacobsen, is looking >>>> specifically into this issue for his master thesis. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> What do you think? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> We are looking for the input and guidance of the Apache community in > moving >>>> the POLOKA proposal forward. Please help! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Regards >>>> >>>> Serge >>>> >>>> >>>> =20 >>> >>> =20 >> >=20 >=20 --=20 Sanjiva Weerawarana, Ph.D. Founder & Director; Lanka Software Foundation; http://www.opensource.lk/ Founder, Chairman & CEO; WSO2, Inc.; http://www.wso2.com/ Member; Apache Software Foundation; http://www.apache.org/ Visiting Lecturer; University of Moratuwa; http://www.cse.mrt.ac.lk/ Blog: http://sanjiva.weerawarana.org/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org