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From "Alan D. Cabrera" <l...@toolazydogs.com>
Subject Re: SVN move
Date Sat, 26 Jul 2008 03:12:24 GMT

On Jul 25, 2008, at 7:38 PM, Craig L Russell wrote:

> Hi Alan,
>
> On Jul 25, 2008, at 3:31 PM, Alan D. Cabrera wrote:
>
>> Some things to consider in this discussion:
>>
>> - The 0.9.0 release cannot be performed off of the copy in ASF
>> - The 0.9.0 or earlier releases cannot be supported off of the copy  
>> in ASF
>>
>> Maybe that's what everyone is thinking.  I just want to make sure  
>> that it's clear.
>
> I don't agree with either of the above opinions. We don't restrict  
> what people do with Apache code.
>
> I don't see anything wrong with publishing a release off the  
> artifacts stored in Apache. It cannot be called "an Apache  
> incubating release" but it can certainly be called JSecurity 0.9  
> whatever.
>
> Follow-on releases can similarly be built from code checked into the  
> Apache repository. They just cannot be called "Apache anything". And  
> if they're published in the jsecurity.org download area they can be  
> maintained in the Apache repository.

I'm not so sure about this.  Is there a precedent for this?

> At some point, the community will have re-packaged stuff into the  
> org.apache.jsecurity name space and built a release from the  
> jsecurity trunk. At that time, they can build an apache incubating  
> jsecurity release and try to get it out "the Apache Way".
>
> The incubator is concerned about the Apache brand. Not with pulling  
> stuff out and calling it jsecurity.org.
>
> I'm copying general at incubator because this discussion needs some  
> more eyes.

Thanks.  I am very interested in what others have to say about this.


Regards,
Alan

>
>
> Craig
>>
>>
>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 1:07 PM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>
>>> I'd like to keep all history, so we don't lose anything along the  
>>> way.  You
>>> never know when you might need to go look back at something for  
>>> comparison.
>>> Plus since SVN atomically increments version numbers across trunk,  
>>> branches
>>> and tags collectively, I don't think you can select just one or  
>>> the other
>>> and still retain all revisions.
>>
>> Yeah, I'm all for importing it with the full history as it's  
>> currently organized at SourceForge.  I just think that we shouldn't  
>> keep anything other than trunk *after* the import for the above  
>> reasons.  If someone really wants that stuff then could dig it up  
>> since it's in SVN.
>>
>> There's a convention here at ASF that anything lying around in SVN  
>> should be supported.
>>
>>> I personally don't think its a big deal just to have a 1:1 move  
>>> and keep
>>> everything the way it is - just my opinion.  After 0.9.0 final is  
>>> released
>>> and we make the switch to org.apache.jsecurity.*, I think it would  
>>> be
>>> self-evident that if you saw something that didn't match that  
>>> package
>>> structure, that it is code that came in before the import.  And  
>>> you would
>>> only see that distinction in tags and branches.  I just don't  
>>> think that
>>> many people would notice that, and if they did, they'd probably be a
>>> developer of the project who was specifically looking for an old  
>>> branch to
>>> begin with.
>>
>> Yeah, but given the above points we really can't have that stuff  
>> lying around, imo.
>>
>>> But this may all be a moot point.  The 'svnsync' command (outlined  
>>> in the
>>> jira issue), requires the very first operation to be revision 0.   
>>> The import
>>> must start on revision 1.  If we were to create an import  
>>> directory in the
>>> repository, that modification would bump up the revision to 1, and  
>>> the
>>> actual code import wouldn't be able to start on revision 1.  I  
>>> don't think
>>> SVN sync allows this - it is a tool for an exact copy only as far  
>>> as I know.
>>
>> Well then I know that this will be impossible then because I know  
>> that ASF, in its infinite wisdumb, put all projects in a single  
>> Subversion database.  So it will be impossible for the very first  
>> operation on our project to be revision 0.
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alan
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 3:43 PM, Alan D. Cabrera <list@toolazydogs.com 
>>> >wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ahh, ok.  My idea was to drop the imported branches and tags and  
>>>> just keep
>>>> trunk.  We would tag it as "import".  Then re-org everything  
>>>> inside trunk
>>>> with the goal of making a 1.0 release that would be acceptable to  
>>>> the
>>>> Incubator.
>>>>
>>>> I guess I just assumed that the history in trunk would be good  
>>>> enough.  If
>>>> someone wanted to look at the old branches and tags it would be  
>>>> simple
>>>> enough to get copies of them using the svn update command.
>>>>
>>>> Just a tought.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Alan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 12:32 PM, Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>>
>>>> All the code being imported has the org.jsecurity package name,  
>>>> including
>>>>> the trunk, tags, and branches, I think it would be less  
>>>>> confusing to put
>>>>> trunk, tags, and branches under a new top level directory called  
>>>>> import.
>>>>>
>>>>> The new top level trunk, tags, and branches would then be where  
>>>>> we migrate
>>>>> the imports/trunk to while changing package names (and licenses as
>>>>> required).
>>>>>
>>>>> It's not clear to me that we should have
>>>>> incubator/jsecurity/tags/0.90-beta2 in the Apache repo. I'd much  
>>>>> prefer to
>>>>> see incubator/jsecurity/import/tags/0.90-beta2.
>>>>>
>>>>> My thoughts on this process are (obviously) evolving. I just  
>>>>> want to make
>>>>> it clear to anyone browsing the Apache repository that there is  
>>>>> legacy code
>>>>> being imported and there is code that will become the Apache  
>>>>> distribution.
>>>>> Just throwing out ideas to make it less opaque.
>>>>>
>>>>> Craig
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 12:09 PM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Actually I don't think that is possible - the existing repo  
>>>>> already has
>>>>>> 'trunk', 'branches' and 'tags' that need to be preserved in the 

>>>>>> same
>>>>>> location.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To achieve what you're talking about, I was hoping we could  
>>>>>> just create
>>>>>> an
>>>>>> 'import' branch immediately after the migration and then start  
>>>>>> using the
>>>>>> trunk after that point as desired.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Would that be acceptable?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 2:49 PM, Craig L Russell <Craig.Russell@sun.com
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is it too late to suggest that the top level directory for the  
>>>>>> imported
>>>>>>> code be "import" and not "trunk"? Using the import directory
 
>>>>>>> would allow
>>>>>>> development to continue (in import) and put all of the future
 
>>>>>>> Apache
>>>>>>> deliverables into trunk.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Craig
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 8:43 AM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ok, I'll let the infrastructure folks know they can blast away
 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> existing
>>>>>>>> one when performing the load.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Les
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 11:04 AM, Alan D. Cabrera <
>>>>>>>> list@toolazydogs.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Crickey, you may be right.  It's simple enough to recreate
 
>>>>>>>> those few
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> files.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> ALan
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 7:58 AM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I want to do it today or tomorrow.  Sunday at the latest
for  
>>>>>>>>> sure.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Just out of curiosity - I see the new SVN is being
used.  
>>>>>>>>>> Won't that
>>>>>>>>>> cause
>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>> conflict for an svnadmin load of the migrated repo?
 I  
>>>>>>>>>> mean, I've
>>>>>>>>>> never
>>>>>>>>>> done
>>>>>>>>>> an svnadmin load on anything other than a fresh repository
 
>>>>>>>>>> - anyone
>>>>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>>>> this is possible?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 10:49 AM, Alan D. Cabrera
<
>>>>>>>>>> list@toolazydogs.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Les, have you been able to make your SVN dump yet?
 When  
>>>>>>>>>> can we
>>>>>>>>>> expect
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> this?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>> Alan
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Craig L Russell
>>>>>>> Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
>>>>>>> 408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
>>>>>>> P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>> Craig L Russell
>>>>> Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
>>>>> 408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
>>>>> P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>
> Craig L Russell
> Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
> 408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
> P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
>


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