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From Craig L Russell <Craig.Russ...@Sun.COM>
Subject Re: SVN move
Date Sat, 26 Jul 2008 02:38:27 GMT
Hi Alan,

On Jul 25, 2008, at 3:31 PM, Alan D. Cabrera wrote:

> Some things to consider in this discussion:
>
> - The 0.9.0 release cannot be performed off of the copy in ASF
> - The 0.9.0 or earlier releases cannot be supported off of the copy  
> in ASF
>
> Maybe that's what everyone is thinking.  I just want to make sure  
> that it's clear.

I don't agree with either of the above opinions. We don't restrict  
what people do with Apache code.

I don't see anything wrong with publishing a release off the artifacts  
stored in Apache. It cannot be called "an Apache incubating release"  
but it can certainly be called JSecurity 0.9 whatever.

Follow-on releases can similarly be built from code checked into the  
Apache repository. They just cannot be called "Apache anything". And  
if they're published in the jsecurity.org download area they can be  
maintained in the Apache repository.

At some point, the community will have re-packaged stuff into the  
org.apache.jsecurity name space and built a release from the jsecurity  
trunk. At that time, they can build an apache incubating jsecurity  
release and try to get it out "the Apache Way".

The incubator is concerned about the Apache brand. Not with pulling  
stuff out and calling it jsecurity.org.

I'm copying general at incubator because this discussion needs some  
more eyes.

Craig
>
>
> On Jul 25, 2008, at 1:07 PM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>
>> I'd like to keep all history, so we don't lose anything along the  
>> way.  You
>> never know when you might need to go look back at something for  
>> comparison.
>> Plus since SVN atomically increments version numbers across trunk,  
>> branches
>> and tags collectively, I don't think you can select just one or the  
>> other
>> and still retain all revisions.
>
> Yeah, I'm all for importing it with the full history as it's  
> currently organized at SourceForge.  I just think that we shouldn't  
> keep anything other than trunk *after* the import for the above  
> reasons.  If someone really wants that stuff then could dig it up  
> since it's in SVN.
>
> There's a convention here at ASF that anything lying around in SVN  
> should be supported.
>
>> I personally don't think its a big deal just to have a 1:1 move and  
>> keep
>> everything the way it is - just my opinion.  After 0.9.0 final is  
>> released
>> and we make the switch to org.apache.jsecurity.*, I think it would be
>> self-evident that if you saw something that didn't match that package
>> structure, that it is code that came in before the import.  And you  
>> would
>> only see that distinction in tags and branches.  I just don't think  
>> that
>> many people would notice that, and if they did, they'd probably be a
>> developer of the project who was specifically looking for an old  
>> branch to
>> begin with.
>
> Yeah, but given the above points we really can't have that stuff  
> lying around, imo.
>
>> But this may all be a moot point.  The 'svnsync' command (outlined  
>> in the
>> jira issue), requires the very first operation to be revision 0.   
>> The import
>> must start on revision 1.  If we were to create an import directory  
>> in the
>> repository, that modification would bump up the revision to 1, and  
>> the
>> actual code import wouldn't be able to start on revision 1.  I  
>> don't think
>> SVN sync allows this - it is a tool for an exact copy only as far  
>> as I know.
>
> Well then I know that this will be impossible then because I know  
> that ASF, in its infinite wisdumb, put all projects in a single  
> Subversion database.  So it will be impossible for the very first  
> operation on our project to be revision 0.
>
>
> Regards,
> Alan
>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 3:43 PM, Alan D. Cabrera <list@toolazydogs.com 
>> >wrote:
>>
>>> Ahh, ok.  My idea was to drop the imported branches and tags and  
>>> just keep
>>> trunk.  We would tag it as "import".  Then re-org everything  
>>> inside trunk
>>> with the goal of making a 1.0 release that would be acceptable to  
>>> the
>>> Incubator.
>>>
>>> I guess I just assumed that the history in trunk would be good  
>>> enough.  If
>>> someone wanted to look at the old branches and tags it would be  
>>> simple
>>> enough to get copies of them using the svn update command.
>>>
>>> Just a tought.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 12:32 PM, Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>
>>> All the code being imported has the org.jsecurity package name,  
>>> including
>>>> the trunk, tags, and branches, I think it would be less confusing  
>>>> to put
>>>> trunk, tags, and branches under a new top level directory called  
>>>> import.
>>>>
>>>> The new top level trunk, tags, and branches would then be where  
>>>> we migrate
>>>> the imports/trunk to while changing package names (and licenses as
>>>> required).
>>>>
>>>> It's not clear to me that we should have
>>>> incubator/jsecurity/tags/0.90-beta2 in the Apache repo. I'd much  
>>>> prefer to
>>>> see incubator/jsecurity/import/tags/0.90-beta2.
>>>>
>>>> My thoughts on this process are (obviously) evolving. I just want  
>>>> to make
>>>> it clear to anyone browsing the Apache repository that there is  
>>>> legacy code
>>>> being imported and there is code that will become the Apache  
>>>> distribution.
>>>> Just throwing out ideas to make it less opaque.
>>>>
>>>> Craig
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 12:09 PM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Actually I don't think that is possible - the existing repo  
>>>> already has
>>>>> 'trunk', 'branches' and 'tags' that need to be preserved in the  
>>>>> same
>>>>> location.
>>>>>
>>>>> To achieve what you're talking about, I was hoping we could just  
>>>>> create
>>>>> an
>>>>> 'import' branch immediately after the migration and then start  
>>>>> using the
>>>>> trunk after that point as desired.
>>>>>
>>>>> Would that be acceptable?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 2:49 PM, Craig L Russell <Craig.Russell@sun.com
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Is it too late to suggest that the top level directory for the  
>>>>> imported
>>>>>> code be "import" and not "trunk"? Using the import directory  
>>>>>> would allow
>>>>>> development to continue (in import) and put all of the future  
>>>>>> Apache
>>>>>> deliverables into trunk.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Craig
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 8:43 AM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ok, I'll let the infrastructure folks know they can blast away  
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> existing
>>>>>>> one when performing the load.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Les
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 11:04 AM, Alan D. Cabrera <
>>>>>>> list@toolazydogs.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Crickey, you may be right.  It's simple enough to recreate  
>>>>>>> those few
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> files.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>> ALan
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jul 25, 2008, at 7:58 AM, Les Hazlewood wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I want to do it today or tomorrow.  Sunday at the latest
for  
>>>>>>>> sure.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Just out of curiosity - I see the new SVN is being used.
 
>>>>>>>>> Won't that
>>>>>>>>> cause
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> conflict for an svnadmin load of the migrated repo? 
I mean,  
>>>>>>>>> I've
>>>>>>>>> never
>>>>>>>>> done
>>>>>>>>> an svnadmin load on anything other than a fresh repository
-  
>>>>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>>> this is possible?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 10:49 AM, Alan D. Cabrera <
>>>>>>>>> list@toolazydogs.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Les, have you been able to make your SVN dump yet?  When
can  
>>>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>>>> expect
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> this?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>> Alan
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Craig L Russell
>>>>>> Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
>>>>>> 408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
>>>>>> P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> Craig L Russell
>>>> Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
>>>> 408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
>>>> P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>

Craig L Russell
Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!


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