From general-return-18071-apmail-incubator-general-archive=incubator.apache.org@incubator.apache.org Mon Apr 28 18:23:19 2008 Return-Path: Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@www.apache.org Received: (qmail 20663 invoked from network); 28 Apr 2008 18:23:17 -0000 Received: from hermes.apache.org (HELO mail.apache.org) (140.211.11.2) by minotaur.apache.org with SMTP; 28 Apr 2008 18:23:17 -0000 Received: (qmail 6249 invoked by uid 500); 28 Apr 2008 18:23:17 -0000 Delivered-To: apmail-incubator-general-archive@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 6073 invoked by uid 500); 28 Apr 2008 18:23:17 -0000 Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Id: Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org Delivered-To: mailing list general@incubator.apache.org Received: (qmail 6062 invoked by uid 99); 28 Apr 2008 18:23:17 -0000 Received: from athena.apache.org (HELO athena.apache.org) (140.211.11.136) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:23:16 -0700 X-ASF-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=10.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE,SPF_PASS X-Spam-Check-By: apache.org Received-SPF: pass (athena.apache.org: domain of ant.elder@gmail.com designates 64.233.170.188 as permitted sender) Received: from [64.233.170.188] (HELO rn-out-0910.google.com) (64.233.170.188) by apache.org (qpsmtpd/0.29) with ESMTP; Mon, 28 Apr 2008 18:22:30 +0000 Received: by rn-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id s46so2024024rnb.3 for ; Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:22:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=TtjW6kiIE5lDQPEaGWUqaSEzdjNvxm1EU5itkV2psX8=; b=cJCMafHp41544Ct8LriX2Sr6hnCyqmcRhkf7ZA6seCAe9XpQO8rndmHCuoFBW45WqIxnduKZp/sBK7VL0azzE0lRh12fyUwqNGYMDiQi+XU7a6h5S1yfRW68W07CnDJnyy0dhyzslpGpy7JfuedQk2sBjGpweCsqiOme+mgI+TE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=f4MYmSzQMueuewB8oTedV7jVy5pbehqPzgnYXLhmXDC4zDlU6mwNZJVZgo4vE3zGYK55UapSUzFZawfma6WbHXI+iu2/WcJv9RoCX9cX9fDvdYh9eyITIcR/aL5umVFtAq2UM72BzNiYP+faQMVu45sISvJZGz5X/hZW3zisba0= Received: by 10.142.125.5 with SMTP id x5mr1722945wfc.124.1209406963043; Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:22:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.142.180.5 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:22:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <71e1b5740804281122w71e27a7aw8f6093a9d7e3df40@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2008 19:22:42 +0100 From: "ant elder" Reply-To: antelder@apache.org To: general@incubator.apache.org Subject: Re: Graduate Tuscany as a top level project In-Reply-To: <71e1b5740804160324h8af17eerb1aecbcb583b12c2@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_6886_11791778.1209406963055" References: <71e1b5740804101327j5e81e008v59218084162c46ae@mail.gmail.com> <200804161141.53439.niclas@hedhman.org> <4805CB21.2040509@rowe-clan.net> <71e1b5740804160324h8af17eerb1aecbcb583b12c2@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Checked: Checked by ClamAV on apache.org ------=_Part_6886_11791778.1209406963055 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 11:24 AM, ant elder wrote: > > > On Wed, Apr 16, 2008 at 10:47 AM, William A. Rowe, Jr. < > wrowe@rowe-clan.net> wrote: > > > On Sunday 13 April 2008 19:30, Robert Burrell Donkin wrote: > > > > > > > IMHO the emphasis on committer affiliation is misguided. overloading > > > > the word diversity was also probably a mistake. maybe we need to > > > > focus > > > > on narrower concepts with alternative names. > > > > > > > > 1. the incubator should be concerned about the composition of the > > > > proposed PMC. > > > > > > > > > Only that the community will be welcoming to newcomers and not treat the > > ASF community-project as the "company's private project"; e.g. stdcxx is > > largely one company, yet and still they brought across 2 mentors (Justin > > and myself) to ensure we continue to foster community with the stdcxx > > user community. A good c++ programmer/open source library user is > > always > > a potential patch contributor, more akin to apr, and very unlike httpd, > > and we see those users to become potential contributors. > > > > Niclas Hedhman wrote: > > > > > > > > Also, my personal and highly subjective interpretation of the (if > > > present) intent around diversity boils down to one scenario; > > > > > > * A company pulls the plug for paid developers - will the project > > > survive? > > > > > > > Actually I think we are far too obsessed with the prospects of letting > > a given project or podling die. So the project passes into lethargy > > and it's time ends, what's really so "negative" about that? We don't > > hold committers to the grindstone, why should we treat employer > > sponsored > > committers any differently? > > > > So, for the case of Tuscany; I am satisfied with the diversity goal, > > > and encourage Tuscany community with the aid of Mentors to move for > > > graduation. > > > > > > > ++1 > > > > So it seems like there is better support for Tuscany graduation now, are > there any other issues or concerns anyone would like to bring up before we > do make another attempt? > > ...ant > > FYI, we've now started the tuscany-dev vote for doing this: http://apache.markmail.org/message/6bduwmwuhntbjafu ...ant ------=_Part_6886_11791778.1209406963055--