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From Martin Sebor <>
Subject Re: PPMC guidance on new committers
Date Fri, 01 Jun 2007 04:02:27 GMT
Craig L Russell wrote:
> Hi Martin,
> On May 30, 2007, at 11:07 AM, Martin Sebor wrote:
>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>> [...]
>>> So IMHO, best practice for podlings is to hold a [DISCUSS] Joe Bleau 
>>> for committer on the PPMC private list, followed by a [VOTE] on the 
>>> PPMC private list, and then a formal [VOTE] on the private incubator 
>>> PMC list with references to the discussion and vote of the PPMC. 
>>> [Only the final vote is binding.]
>> How could a PPMC participate in a vote on the Incubator PMC's private
>> list?
> It cannot, and I don't believe I implied that this would be the case. 
> The idea is that the PPMC, with the help of the Mentors, conducts a 
> discussion and a vote just as they would if they were a TLP PMC. What 
> we're trying to do in the incubator is to give the PPMC the opportunity 
> to act like a PMC and this committer discussion and vote is one of the 
> most important things to learn.

How could they learn anything when some of the most important decisions
were made behind closed doors (i.e., on the Incubator private list?)

>> Even if the PPMC's private list were CC'd on the initial vote
>> there would be no way for the PPMC members to know whether they were
>> being CC'd on all the relevant discussions and given sufficient
>> opportunity to address any concerns.
> I guess this would be the responsibility of the Mentors to carry any 
> feedback from the incubator PMC vote. During the incubator PMC vote, the 
> Mentors will be active in responding to any concerns of the incubator PMC.

That sounds backwards. Aren't each podling's mentors supposed to
represent the Incubator PMC on the podling's PPMC? Doesn't the PMC
trust the mentors to adequately represent them? It seems to me that
if a mentor has reason to be concerned about a committer vote they
can bring it up on the Incubator PMC list. Otherwise there should
be no reason to involve it. If there are Incubator PMC members who
are concerned about a podling's ability to make these type of
decisions despite the oversight of its mentors they have the option
of subscribing to the PPMC list or even becoming mentors themselves.
Otherwise, it would be hard to argue that they have the insight
necessary to make these types of fundamental decisions for the PPMC.


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