Mailing-List: contact general-help@incubator.apache.org; run by ezmlm
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: general@incubator.apache.org
Received-SPF: pass (herse.apache.org: domain of pzfreo@gmail.com designates
 64.233.162.193 as permitted sender)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws;
        s=beta; d=gmail.com;
        h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references;
        b=li+5IZQ3Z3KdL3YCkRy9sG7AnVvCRPxqOWjXOZA894dREyzPnLTDVmEl0dFCb+LrlBMNsdGy7juosLmX4ozX87dezJXRlRkXALR0tvvmEPPiaY/rIXbOXxgG/hsQTgtmamUFDxc1hhr+9ZyOxGu3O3kJADzOZzZOZUkihmN/K4g=
Message-ID: <88f5d710611170620t13856f94s7bb553b6e6644a49@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 14:20:57 +0000
From: "Paul Fremantle" <pzfreo@gmail.com>
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Including snapshot dependencies from other ASF projects
In-Reply-To: <db94f1a0611170404v31433ad2mb265adaf8795c615@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline
References: <c5e632550611170036y4f3f1b99xba01fcbadd91c4d0@mail.gmail.com>
	 <510143ac0611170137y5a5a5d01yb08db15c5b1f8107@mail.gmail.com>
	 <88f5d710611170353h5e7b1eb1j73b974369da07a2a@mail.gmail.com>
	 <db94f1a0611170404v31433ad2mb265adaf8795c615@mail.gmail.com>

> For Incubating projects, I'm very hesitant about the above.  The
> reason is that we've been paying a lot of attention to podling
> releases and validation thereof.  If the dependency podling, MINA in
> this case, has never had an ASF-approved release, we're getting into
> dicey territory, and I would say, reluctantly, that its binaries
> shouldn't be included in another project.

If we just suppose for a minute that MINA is an external project (not
an Apache project), then we would have a process for validating its
inclusion in the release as an external codebase.

So the fact that MINA is an incubating project shouldn't make it
*harder* to include than a non-Apache project. Or - as you are
suggesting - impossible. If you say that qpid cannot use *any* code
from any incubator project, then by extension that would logically
imply that no Apache project should ever be released with any
non-Apache dependencies included.

Since the MINA code that they wish to release has not been approved by
the Incubator for release, we cannot rely on a previous review.
Therefore the releasing project (e.g. qpid) has to do all the right
checks on the MINA code as well as the QPID code. That is the QPID
team and Incubator team should make no assumptions about the ability
to ship the MINA code. However, the Incubator team should be able to
validate the MINA code just as much as the qpid code.

I suggest that the qpid team as for the support of the MINA mentors at
the point they come to request a release vote for qpid.

If that is all done then there should be no issue in the release
including MINA code.

Paul


>
> Yoav
>
> On 11/17/06, Paul Fremantle <pzfreo@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Jukka
> >
> > As a general point, there may be a significant delay in getting a
> > release with a given patch in it. For example, the Synapse incubator
> > relies on Axis2. Axis2 is a fairly significant project and they would
> > be unlikely to be willing or able to create a release with a few minor
> > patches outside of their planned release cycle. I would not expect
> > them to either.
> >
> > So while that is one answer, I don't think it will always apply in every case.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > On 11/17/06, Jukka Zitting <jukka.zitting@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > On 11/17/06, Cliff Schmidt <cliffschmidt@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > The Qpid community has been debating whether or not they should
> > > > include an unreleased snapshot version of MINA within their upcoming
> > > > Qpid release, and whether they would even be allowed to do so by
> > > > "Apache rules".
> > >
> > > Did you already consider working with the MINA community to have a
> > > proper release as your dependency? I don't think it should be too hard
> > > to do, the main issues being:
> > >
> > > 1) Technical: Is the code good enough for a release? You already think
> > > the code is good.
> > >
> > > 2) Community: Is there a release manager? If no-one in the MINA
> > > community is interested, there's no stopping one of you from
> > > volunteering.
> > >
> > > 3) Oversight: Is the PMC ready to approve the release? This should
> > > really be up to the MINA PMC to decide.
> > >
> > > BR,
> > >
> > > Jukka Zitting
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Paul Fremantle
> > VP/Technology, WSO2 and OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair
> >
> > http://bloglines.com/blog/paulfremantle
> > paul@wso2.com
> >
> > "Oxygenating the Web Service Platform", www.wso2.com
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>


-- 
Paul Fremantle
VP/Technology, WSO2 and OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair

http://bloglines.com/blog/paulfremantle
paul@wso2.com

"Oxygenating the Web Service Platform", www.wso2.com

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org