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From "Paul Fremantle" <>
Subject Re: IRC chats
Date Tue, 10 Oct 2006 16:46:50 GMT

I understand your concerns. However, we have switched our model, based
on feedback from the Incubator PMC, and for *our* project, it has been
negative rather than positive. I'm not trying to make a general point,
as I only have one data point.

I don't believe we've ever had the problems you mention, but its good
to be aware of potential problems, and I, for one, will be vigilant.


On 10/10/06, Justin Erenkrantz <> wrote:
> On 10/10/06, Paul Fremantle <> wrote:
> > 1) we log the chats to the dev list (yes I know we always did)
> > 2) If we have any proposals in the chats we explicitly send these out
> > as separate notes and follow up in email to make any decisions. In
> > other words the IRC chats are not formal decision making forums
> > (fora?) but there to stimulate discussion.
> > 3) we choose a time that is as convenient as possible to all our
> > global contributors.
> This is an extremely fine line to walk, so you must be prepared to be
> vigilant about ensuring that you don't present the IRC discussions as
> a fait accompli - and permit a true and honest discussion on-list.
> All decisions need to happen on the list, or it is as if the decision
> didn't occur.
> Some projects in the past went through the motions you listed here,
> but didn't allow discussions to happen: it was presented as more of a
> "here's what we decided" instead of "here's what we're thinking of
> doing, what do you think?"  And, it may even put people off just by
> tone - even if you say the right words, others may get frustrated if
> they can't attend the IRC meetings as it seems that their input is not
> valued.
> So, I'd urge against IRC chats, but if you're careful, it can work.  -- justin
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Paul Fremantle
VP/Technology, WSO2 and OASIS WS-RX TC Co-chair

"Oxygenating the Web Service Platform",

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