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From Eduardo Pelegri-Llopart <pele...@sun.com>
Subject Re: [Proposal] Blaze
Date Wed, 09 Aug 2006 00:21:15 GMT
[sorry for the delayed response but just catching up on this thread...]

This seems a good moment to remind that we hope this issue has been 
fixed for all Java EE APIs through Project GlassFish.  We are aware of a 
few APIs that have not yet been pushed out under CDDL but our plan is to 
complete those.

regarding the original question,  IANAL but, no a random person cannot 
go and borrow IP from a javadoc.

	- eduard/o

Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
> 
> James Strachan wrote:
> 
>>I guess its a murky area legally - making similar APIs using
>>documentation as a guide. e.g. its quite striking how many extremely
>>similar APIs are in .Net and Mono to the JDK.
>>
>>FWIW there's a current practice to get around Sun's bizarre licensing
>>on various Java/J2EE APIs - folks type in their own version of the
>>source code using the javadoc as a guide. e.g. try the
>>geronimo-spec-*.jar as an Apache licensed version of the
>>crappily-licensed-Sun J2EE jars. I guess thats legal right? So maybe
>>just using documentation to create similar APIs on other platforms is
>>OK?
> 
> 
> That's not why people do it - they do it because until recently, Sun's
> binaries for for the API classes/interfaces were available only under
> unacceptable restrictive terms.
> 
> geir
> 
> 
>>
>>On 7/20/06, robert.j.greig@jpmorgan.com <robert.j.greig@jpmorgan.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>I think there may be some legal issues with creating an API that
>>>resembles
>>>JMS too closely.
>>>
>>>>From the JMS licence terms:
>>>
>>>"Subject to the terms and conditions of this license, Sun hereby
>>>grants you
>>>a fully-paid, non-exclusive, non-transferable, worldwide, limited
>>>license (without the right to sublicense) under Sun's intellectual
>>>property
>>>rights to review the Specification internally solely for the purpose
>>>of designing and developing your Java applets and applications
>>>intended to
>>>run on the Java platform. Other than this limited license, you
>>>acquire no right, title or interest in or to the Specification or any
>>>other
>>>Sun intellectual property. The Specification contains the proprietary
>>>information of Sun and may only be used in accordance with the license
>>>terms set forth herein."
>>>
>>>The key bit here is "intended to run on the Java platform".
>>>
>>>That said there is definitely merit in having our .NET API and C++ API
>>>being relatively similar.
>>>
>>>XMS for C# does resemble JMS very closely although with delegates and
>>>with
>>>the naming convention for interfaces. I am not sure whether IBM would be
>>>interested in donating XMS.
>>>
>>>RG
>>>
>>>
>>>|---------+---------------------------->
>>>|         |           "James Strachan" |
>>>|         |           <james.strachan@g|
>>>|         |           mail.com>        |
>>>|         |                            |
>>>|         |           19/07/2006 20:50 |
>>>|         |           Please respond to|
>>>|         |           general          |
>>>|---------+---------------------------->
>>> 
>>>
>>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
>>>
>>> 
>>>|                                                                            
                                                
>>>|
>>>  |       To:      
>>>general@incubator.apache.org                                                 
                              
>>>|
>>>  |      
>>>cc:                                                                          
                                        
>>>|
>>>  |       Subject:  Re: [Proposal]
>>>Blaze                                                                        
               
>>>|
>>> 
>>>
>>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On 7/19/06, Paul Fremantle <pzfreo@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Currently ActiveMQ has several C/C++ clients (with another client
>>>>>library waiting to get through the  donator's lawyers), so it might
>>>>>make sense at some point to try unify the C++ clients together too so
>>>>>users have a single C++ API for their messaging client and then a
>>>>>number of implentations/transports/protocols to use at deployment
>>>>>time. i.e. making a JMS for C++ API. (We've got a good start called
>>>>>CMS in ActiveMQ...)
>>>>
>>>>I agree that a C++ (and also C) rendering of a JMS like API is going
>>>>to be a very useful thing.
>>>>
>>>>James - do you have any idea how CMS matches or differs from IBM's XMS
>>>>(
>>>
>>>http://www-128.ibm.com/developerworks/websphere/library/techarticles/0509_phillips/0509_phillips.html
>>>
>>>)?
>>>
>>>>XMS is also a rendering of JMS into C/C#/C++.
>>>
>>>Thanks for the link! I've had a quick look and it looks remarkably
>>>close to the current CMS client. Hardly surprising I guess since they
>>>are both kinda clones of the JMS API but in C++ and using JMS 1.1 and
>>>mostly ignoring the crappy bits of JMS 1.0.2b :)
>>>
>>>I couldn't see the C# client so not sure if we differ a bit there - we
>>>ended up changing the C# client a little from JMS to make use of C#
>>>coding conventions and features (like delegates and events etc) - and
>>>we followed that sucky C# practice of naming interfaces IConnection
>>>etc :). Not sure if the XMS in C# does the same. (We imaginatively
>>>called the C# client NMS for .Net Messaging System).
>>>
>>>I wonder if IBM and the XMS folks would be interested in donating the
>>>*API* code for XMS to Apache and working with other folks at Apache so
>>>we can merge some of the C/C++/C# clients together into a single
>>>reuable client API with pluggable providers (and maybe even some
>>>resuable optional implementation code different implementations could
>>>choose to reuse)?
>>>
>>>There's clearly a delta between AMQP and the features of JMS, but even
>>>if we just get the core JMS semantics reusable across the clients it'd
>>>be a big win IMHO.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I think it would be interesting to see a confluence of the APIs and
>>>>protocols between ActiveMQ and Blaze giving interoperability in both
>>>>code and on the wire.
>>>
>>>Agreed.
>>>-- 
>>>
>>>James
>>>-------
>>>http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
>>>
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>>
>>
> 
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