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From "robert burrell donkin" <>
Subject Re: [PROPOSAL] Open JPA
Date Wed, 08 Mar 2006 22:02:14 GMT
On 3/8/06, Thomas Dudziak <> wrote:
> On 3/8/06, Alan D. Cabrera <> wrote:
> > Is duplication really that bad?  So long as the communities are vibrant,
> > why should we care?  Also, have you factored in different requirements
> > and different implementation strategies for the projects in your list of
> > duplications?  I've always liked the idea of software Darwinism.  Many
> > different exciting ideas with the community deciding which ones are the
> > good ones.
> >
> > IMHO, having unified projects stifles that diversity.

it's a balancing act: cross-fertilization is also a powerful force

> I'm not talking about unifying the projects. In fact, IMO the more
> different ways to deal with objects (or not) and databases in Apache,
> the better. It gives the user choices to choose the best for his
> problem at hand.
> The problem is more that e.g. there are only so many ways to access a
> database via JDBC irrespective of what the project does then. And this
> kind of knowledge (and perhaps even code) is not shared but
> gained/duplicated again and again for every project.

there are two distinct dimensions here: the legal one and the community one.

umbrella-ish projects cause worries about legal oversight. that
develops into a need for rules and for people to ensure that those
rules are enforced. the cost of keeping a umbrella project together in
a legally robust fashion is too high.

(at one time in the old days, i subscribed to every jakarta
development list and tried to read every mail and review every commit.
it didn't take me very many weeks of spending 4-5 hours a night just
reading the 500+ emails a day requered before i came to the conclusion
that umbrella projects can't scale.)

but by flattening the structure, we've lost as well as gained...

one of the issues currently facing apache is how to build larger
communities which are not umbrellas but which allow
cross-fertilization of ideas. the current favourite candidate is a
more federationish structure with more limited legal duties.

if this sounds fuzzy: that's because it is! it's an open question :)

- robert

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