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From David Crossley <>
Subject Re: [RT] Super Simple Site Generation Tool
Date Fri, 30 Dec 2005 02:44:25 GMT
Greg Stein wrote:
> David Crossley wrote:
> >...
> > If people have issues with Forrest, then please take them
> > to the user@forrest mailing list. It is totally unfair
> > to a new project to just criticise it from afar. We get
> > very few emails to the user mailing list about any issues
> > with Forrest. This seems to be especially the case with
> > committers from Apache projects that decided to use Forrest.
> >...
> > There are zero postings from Leo to user@forrest and
> > one or two relevant ones to dev@forrest.
> This isn't surprising. When Forrest was deployed for the Incubator,
> and we first started having problems with it and talking about
> jettisoning it, then you (David) appeared saying "I'll provide all the
> help you need to use Forrest for the Incubator." So all the questions
> and concerns stayed right here.

I came in long after Forrest was being employed, following
one person's plea for help to forrest-dev. I didn't
know of any jettison intentions - perhaps that was on
pmc@incubator. I doubt that i would offer to provide
"all the help" as i recognise that i am an over-committed
volunteer. It requires other people to get involved.
I certainly did help as much as i could, but i have not
pushed for the Incubator to continue to use Forrest.
In fact i have often suggested that it be relieved.

> IMO, I'm also +1 on tossing it.

I am +0, meaning that i doubt that i will be able to
help. Certainly i will try, but i am not committing
to doing the work nor writing any new howto documentation.
Thankfully because the source documents are in plain
html, then it would be easy to retain the content and
just use some other tool. Perhaps we can make forrest
output in whatever format is needed.

> The last time that I had to update the
> incubator site, I had to download a JRE for my box. Then I had to
> *checkout* about dozen *megabytes* of various java projects. I'm
> talking about megabytes of *source* code. That got built into
> something like another 60 megabytes over the next 30 minutes. Then I
> had to get the thing running against my Incubator site checkout. Once
> I got it all working, then I was able to make my 10-line edit.

Please do not exaggerate.

> No thanks. It is really cumbersome to use. I'm not about to go and
> build another Forrest just to edit some Incubator pages.

Grrr, not from you too. Please either read the earlier
comments in this thread and my previous proposal, or
go direct to
You *only* need to edit the source. There is no excuse.


> Like Justin,
> I'll just go do one of the other billion things that interests me more
> than fighting with a huge publishing system. And that is kind of sad,
> given that the Incubator should remain updated and fresh, as it is one
> of the first things that many new folks see when they come to Apache.
> I think Forrest can be a great tool, but I don't think it is
> appropriate for the Incubator. We've been fighting against it for a
> LONG time now, and I think that (empirically) says that it just isn't
> suitable for this PMC, its community, and what it is trying to do.
> Cheers,
> -g
> -- 
> Greg Stein,

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